New Cultural recipes (test server)

[Ngreth Thergn]

While to some fol;ks it may be "annoying" to have to gain skill...

We instead see it as giving value to gaining a skill. More value than just "I have a better chance." So now having a high skill has a real value.

Additionally... there is nothing in the book itself that skill restricts. Just on the NPC. I am sure you can figure it out.

[Xenephex]

Additionally... there is nothing in the book itself that skill restricts. Just on the NPC. I am sure you can figure it out.

/bonks himself in the head. I didn't even think to look at that. That will help me with templates, but I'm not aware of an active dwarven smith on test with a higher skill (I'm sure there are some, I just don't know who they are), so I still need to skill up to get the final recipes.

BTW, I bugged it, but there are no plate template recipes for breastplates. The molds are there, but not the recipes and that seems to apply for all different types of ore.

I combined a stack of rhenium bracer templates this morning. It is amazingly easy. Walk into the western trader building in PoK with your ore, smithy hammer and water, and everything else is on the vendor next to the forge. No subcombines, just buy the 3 items and click away. The coal for rhenium (black nitrous) costs 32 plat (and change) each and stacks to 200. The molds and resulting templates each stack to 5. The metal tempering chemicals stack to 20 iirc. chemicals and molds are like 1G each. Sellback on success is 29 plat so you lost 3 plat and some change on a success and 32 plat on a failure.

I got two skillups also (coincidental I'm sure), to 257. Farming more rhenium as we speak.

[Ngreth Thergn]

TEMPLATES have no bonuses.

Some of the final cultural armor does.

Nothing has a penalty anymore.

[Zopharr]

TEMPLATES have no bonuses.

Some of the final cultural armor does.

Nothing has a penalty anymore.

Some stuff has had a penalty to skillups? Wow, smithing since before metal plates stacked - didn't know that.

Can you tell us what did? Even it it is after the patch...just curious.

Garshok

[Zopharr]

While to some folks it may be "annoying" to have to gain skill...

We instead see it as giving value to gaining a skill. More value than just "I have a better chance." So now having a high skill has a real value.

I don't think it's "annoying." I'm working on Zopharr's skill as time/supplies allows to get it to 300 just because, well, it's the 'right thing to do' since he's a smith; likewise with Rish.

I was thinking more of the real rush I got when I was finally able too finish Zopharr's armor, or Rish finally got his arms (after starting smithing because I hadn't been able to find a troll smith on the server for six months). I want others to be able to get that same 'rush' that I did.

If smithing TS drops at higher levels will be dropping from roughly one mob in 8 (if I understand the thread elsewhere properly), though, it should be a relatively moot point. Thanks!

Garshok

[Ngreth Thergn]

Some stuff has had a penalty to skillups? Wow, smithing since before metal plates stacked - didn't know that.

Can you tell us what did? Even it it is after the patch...just curious.

Garshok

sorry not a penalty to skill-up, but a penalty to succeeding in the combine (which for some cases for people with stats less than 400 ends up being a small penalty to skill up) That is what was no included in the re-design.

[Xenephex]

Still can't see gm level recipes on the vendors at skill 270. Hoping they will be there at 275. Gotta wonder what level you're going to have to be to see the next level of cultural that's coming with the new expansion.

[Gaell Stormracer]

sorry not a penalty to skill-up, but a penalty to succeeding in the combine (which for some cases for people with stats less than 400 ends up being a small penalty to skill up) That is what was no included in the re-design.

Um, still don't understand that... so is chance to skill up now independent of whether you succeed or fail the combine? or was that a reference to the success rate caps?

[Ngreth Thergn]

Um, still don't understand that... so is chance to skill up now independent of whether you succeed or fail the combine? or was that a reference to the success rate caps?

The DoN Combines, when they came out, had a "minimum fail chance" put on the.
The new ones do not.

The poster asked if this affected skillups.
It ONLY did by the normal skillup formula that you have a better chance to gain skillups if you succeed at the combine instead of failing at the combine.

The fact that those combines made you fail more often, made you check the fail chance to gain skill more often, overall reducing your chance to gain a skillup.

Really high stats though mitigate the penalty on failure chance skillup, and for smithing at 400 that fail chance to skillup = success chance to skillup.

better? Not sure I can make it clearer because of course the whole thing is inherently confusing

[Xenephex]

Couple of things. First of all, you CAN learn the new recipes the old fashioned way - by experimenting and succeeding. That is probably a really good thing as my hopes of being able to 'see' the GM level recipes on vendors at 275 (or 280 or 290 for that matter) appears ill-founded. I talked to a skill 298 smith in game this morning and he said he STILL can't see the highest level recipes. So evidently you need to be a 300 smith to actually be able to buy them and scribe them. 300 smiths are the only ones I know of who have actually bought these recipes.

This seems unnecessarily high to me. In fact it seems ridiculously high. What skill will you have to be to see the SoF recipes?

I know someone who is skill 237 that can see the same recipes I can see at skill 270 (and evidently will be able to see at 298). That's at least 61 points of skill (and likely more) with no new recipes. I really don't understand that.

Another thing I didn't mention above. There is only one loam required for any of the final recipes, be it bracer or breastplate. The template recipes require 1 to 3 ores in the same ratio as the existing cultural recipes. This is really good news in terms of drops, since the same rare drop now gives you a shot at any piece of the armor. It's no more difficult to get a drop for a breastplate than it is for a bracer. More ore of course, but ore is common enough that it is a non-issue.

[melkorr]

And the plan is yes, they cannot be done experiment mode, until you learn it. Once you learn it (by scribing the book) you can do it, if for some reason you prefer the "experiment mode" interface.

Couple of things. First of all, you CAN learn the new recipes the old fashioned way - by experimenting and succeeding.

Confused. Xenephex, have you personally done the new Test server combines and had them added to your list without using the book?

Also, anyone wanna start a list of what levels of books they can see at what skill level? Would help us figure out where the new skill tiers start as far as requirements to see the books.

[Maevenniia]

where are these vendors? teh home cities?

[Xenephex]

Yes, I have done and learned recipes that I did not have scribed from books - GM level recipes in books that I could not see on the vendors. I did a bunch of plate bracer templates (which take Cobalt ore), and one Elaborate Stormguard Boots. I had to guess at the ingredients for both, though it wasn't that hard to figure out for the template (I just bought the next most expensive coal type on the vendor).

The recipe books are on vendors in PoK, Abysmal Sea and Crescent Reach. They show up on FIND under the category Tradeskill_Books. The ones in PoK are in an alcove just outside the entrance to the library, up in the area where the Priest of Discord stands.

It's a good idea to start a list of when the various books become visible according to skill level. However, I expect that when this goes live that high level tradeskillers will simply buy multiple copies of the higher level books and sell them in the bazaar (I would gladly pay a premium price for the dwarven cultural books right now).

Here is a list of the various ores in the game along with the trivial for a bracer template combine:

Tin -- 20
Iron -- 40
Sivril -- 66
Thallium -- 90
Iridium -- 124
Fulginate -- 158
Rubicite -- 196
Indium -- 234
Rhenium -- 272
Tungsten -- 310
Cobalt -- 348

Breastplate template combines range from 10 trivial points higher for Tin to 20 points higher for Tungsten. I haven't attempted a Cobalt Breastplate Template yet so I don't know how much higher that one is. Other armor piece combines fall in between.

[Ngreth Thergn]

Confused. Xenephex, have you personally done the new Test server combines and had them added to your list without using the book?

and I believe that this is a bug. One I am willing to live with for now, but a bug nonetheless.

Also note. It is a bug that is in Que to be fixed, so it will not be there long.

[Bara]

and I believe that this is a bug. One I am willing to live with for now, but a bug nonetheless.

Also note. It is a bug that is in Que to be fixed, so it will not be there long.

And this is why I've been busting my back to get to 300 skill. No matter what; if I can max out skill I figure I'll have the least to worry about when these go live.

And by the way Ngreth, the new system sounds thoughfuly designed and logical. Your punishment for a job well done is to rationalize another tradeskill!