Making Recipe Books useful

[Unapuma]

I'd be glad to help as well. Yes it is still early as you said but when you go through with the change, it'd help if we could cover all the bassure any quest doesn't get broken inadverantly in the process, suggestions and feedbacks, etc.

[Bobaten]

If you mean in this possible future change to tradeskills? Had not really thought about that part in detail, but probably not. There would not be changes to existing recipes, they would just work with the list interface as they do today. That interface may change in some way to allow for more than 10 items to be shown, but overall, the same interface. The existing recipes would not change, but future recipes could be quite different.

It was the possible future change I was wondering about. The recipe books for the slot 12 augments come from a series of tasks. These tasks are currently uneccessary for anyone who gets the recipes from an out of game source. Removing learning by experiment would require future tinkers to complete these tasks. Clearing the previously learned recipes would require current tinkers to complete these tasks.
These books are not no trade, so I can also see a sudden market for them developing. But a further thought along that line, would it be possible for one character to teach another character their learned recipes?

[Paloverde]

I am not really clear on how the new trade skill combines would work. But I offer this comment from a tradeskiller whose carried inventory and bank inventory is often overflowing. The world containers offer an option to combine someplace other than in a container held in inventory. And I use the looms sometimes, especially for recipes that need to be learned, simply because my tailoring kit is full. I hope this circumstance would be taken into consideration in any new scheme.

[EloMist]

But a further thought along that line, would it be possible for one character to teach another character their learned recipes?

I recall, as a new player, a dear friend telling me of a MUDD she played in which a character could mentor an apprentice, teaching them skills to give them a leg up. She loved playing EQ but truly missed that aspect of MORPG.

Could this be a step in that direction for EQ? Perhaps. I think it would be neat myself. Not that it would necessarily be easy to implement or anything. But for those who have numerous characters who tradeskill... (yes, I'm nuts) it would save much redundant travel around the world just to learn how to make fishrolls. It would also allow for more player interaction outside of combat related issues. I recall enjoying finding folks that would teach me languages and later that I could teach in return.

This is just a /cheer for a great idea, IMO, and a show of support for its consideration as things progress.

[Aldier]

I think it would take a lot away from the discovery process (as painful as it is at times).

I remember when the Bristlebane Challenge was being worked out that the hardest part was to figure out what the one missing ingredient was. Or to decipher the riddles and hints that you left in game for us. If you had a task that just told you what piece to go get, I think it would not be as fun. Then again, there would not be any headaches trying to figure out the actual recipe that drags on for months.

I think there is some good to your idea and based on your previous tradeskill changes/implamentations, I look forward to seeing what you can come up with.

[Ngreth Thergn]

But a further thought along that line, would it be possible for one character to teach another character their learned recipes?

That is not currently in the plans, and certainly not in the current implementation. It is something that can be considered though.

[Ngreth Thergn]

I think it would take a lot away from the discovery process (as painful as it is at times).

I remember when the Bristlebane Challenge was being worked out that the hardest part was to figure out what the one missing ingredient was. Or to decipher the riddles and hints that you left in game for us. If you had a task that just told you what piece to go get, I think it would not be as fun. Then again, there would not be any headaches trying to figure out the actual recipe that drags on for months.

I think there is some good to your idea and based on your previous tradeskill changes/implamentations, I look forward to seeing what you can come up with.

Well for that example... certain lines of the task would be the riddle. Not giving it away outright. But yeah, it would not be as "difficult" anymore.

[natefu]

Well for that example... certain lines of the task would be the riddle. Not giving it away outright. But yeah, it would not be as "difficult" anymore.

Does it have to be only one way or the other? Experimentation or Books? Is it possible to implement the books, but also leave some recipes undocumented?

One more question

What about recipes that are so far undiscovered? If tradeskills are moved to a new system that is fully book-based, will those undiscovered recipes be included in the new books?

Overall, I kinda like this idea imo, I think a combo of the current experimenting system and a 'book-learned' system would be the best.

[Tiroon]

They may no longer be useful for that and folks have to go back to relying on tailors to make them big bags.

Reading through the posts just made me wonder: Am I the only one whose new characters' first trip in EQ is to the bazaar? Not to buy stuff but to fill their bank space with trader satchels.

[Unapuma]

Trader Statchels may be ok for bank space but defiantly not for carrying around. I do know some low level toon uses deluxe toolboxes for carrying around as they weight little and are far cheaper than hand made backpack.

[Bobaten]

If quests will still use combine containers, it might be possible for something like the Bristlebane's Challenge "quest" use a special container where you would essentially have experiment mode. Then once you completed that part of the quest, you would learn the recipe.
Of course, that would still mean that recipies quested this way would be limited to 10 components.

[Unapuma]

Or leave the recipe exactly as they are: instead the recipe book will be in the form of a few different cryptic notes scattered about that you have to farm all to "learn" the entire BBC The same cryptic notes that some players went nut trying to solve last year. =)

This will make starting the recipe a bit harder but the ground spawn is consistient so it's onlky a matter of getting it before someone elce gets to it or waiting for the ground spawn to respawn.

[Ngreth Thergn]

Does it have to be only one way or the other? Experimentation or Books? Is it possible to implement the books, but also leave some recipes undocumented?

not if there are no longer containers to "experiment" in. Theer wsould have to be a task or quest type thing for it.

One more question

What about recipes that are so far undiscovered? If tradeskills are moved to a new system that is fully book-based, will those undiscovered recipes be included in the new books?

Overall, I kinda like this idea imo, I think a combo of the current experimenting system and a 'book-learned' system would be the best.

dunno yet

[Ngreth Thergn]

If quests will still use combine containers, it might be possible for something like the Bristlebane's Challenge "quest" use a special container where you would essentially have experiment mode. Then once you completed that part of the quest, you would learn the recipe.
Of course, that would still mean that recipies quested this way would be limited to 10 components.

Possibly, It would not be tied to a "skill" (though I could use a script to check for a min skill type thing... ) but it is at least an idea that may work.

[Liwsa]

Question:

Right now we have racial sewing kits to do race restricted combines in, How will these be handled?

If we can no longer "open" them to be containers will they have to be stored in an inventory slot or will they now "fit" into bags since they are no longer considered containers so it would not be "trying to put a bag into a bag"?

I have in my bank:
wood elf fletching kit
wood elf sewing kit
coldian sewing kit
reinforced jewelry bag.

Since all of these containers are needed for certain combines I cannot get rid of them. If all of these now take up a slot, but cannot be used as a container to hold items when not in use as a kit, then most of us will lose 4-6 main bag slots and 20-40 bag slots. We all know how precious bank space is to tradeskillers

Will it still be necessary to have diferent sewing kits for different combines?
culturial kit - culturial combines
coldian kit - Velious combines
planer kit - PoP combines


Thanks.