Next Weeks Update...

[Yitara]

If you've won 250 ldons, you have time to raid more than likely.

And it's not a tradeskill quest item. It's a quest item that requires tradeskills. Just because something requires tradeskills doesn't mean that, like developing on Linux, it is contaminated and will forever be a "tradeskill item."

It's not a reward for time invested, it's a reward for time effectively invested in your growth.

Getting flagged isn't that hard. It's really not.

No, LDONs and raiding for flags are completely different. I have a 3 year old and a 5 year old. I get 2 to 3 hours to play some nights after they go to bed. I can do one, sometimes two, LDONs in that time if I choose to not work on tradeskills. I don't have the freedom to play for long stretches at a time, nor can I log on at any time of the day when a mob is "up". I don't belong to a big guild that can flag my guy while I am at work (yes, it happens). Getting flagged for me is VERY had, it really is. Our group did PoJ and we could probably do Hedge in a night. Over time we have taken out most of the giants in PoS. But those are the easy events that don't require a huge time sink or raiding party.

As I say, I have tried two open raids on the rare weekend days I had some time to play, we got wiped both times, and that was only MB in POI. This weekend I spent about two hours waiting for an open raid on TT cause I was told at 65 I didn't need the Hedge flag to get in. Guess what? They were wrong and I couldn't zone in. How many more open raids like that must I try to attend to get elemental flagged? Well, sorry, I have better things to do and maybe some of them don't involve EQ.

And, no, I disagree, its not a quest that requires some tradeskilling, its all tradeskilling. The "quest" part is the same as getting flagged for the planes. You can't tie that to the Aid Grimmel quest. Having the final earring be the flag to get into PoTime would truly make it a quest that has "some tradeskilling" involved. Hehe, that would be poetic justice.

I guess what irks me the most is I realize because of my playing patterns and my guild size I don't get to do a lot of things like Vex Thall, or Ssra Temple, or Innrouk, or etc. That's fine, it never bothered me, instead I put my time into small group stuff and tradeskills. Then, along comes PoP and not only can I not even go to most zones, but the one item that I could make to justify all the time I spent working on tradeskills is completely unobtaibable because the uber guilds don't want me to disrupt their raids? I would laugh if it weren't so painful.

Oh well, this is all close to being a moot point anyway. I will just move on to GoD soon and forget it.

[kiztent]

Well, sorry, I have better things to do and maybe some of them don't involve EQ.

...

I guess what irks me the most is I realize because of my playing patterns and my guild size I don't get to do a lot of things like Vex Thall, or Ssra Temple, or Innrouk, or etc.

Pardon my snipping.

As I said... you can raid, you don't want to. Given that, you can't hardly be angry you can't get the raid rewards. Well, you can, but it's sort of silly. "My family (I'm assuming family here, if not, substitute) is more important to me than EQ, but I'm mad that it prevents me from getting cool stuff."

If you want other things to be more important than EQ, accept the consequences of that.

[Sharrien]

I also don't think that Grimel should check for flags to allow the turn ins. Considering the amount of time and plat that has to be invested in attaining the minimum tradeskill levels just to do the combines, the flag requirement is just an extra headache. If someone can afford to buy components for tailoring/fletching/baking and succeed in the combines then they should be rewarded. They shouldn't have to hang around begging to be allowed into another guild's raid. It's a little humiliating and demoralizing since it rarely happens.

Should we keep the flags requirements because the reward should only be for those people who can invest the time to be in a raiding guild? I disagree. Tradeskilling is a separate path of advancement from flagging. Besides, there are a thousand uberlicious no-drop items on the loot tables of PoP mobs accessible only if you are in a raiding guild. Let the hard-working, accomplished tradeskillers have a chance to complete most of the Grimel quest so that they can get their hands on at least one nice item for their efforts.

[Lilosh]

Pardon my snipping.

As I said... you can raid, you don't want to. Given that, you can't hardly be angry you can't get the raid rewards. Well, you can, but it's sort of silly. "My family (I'm assuming family here, if not, substitute) is more important to me than EQ, but I'm mad that it prevents me from getting cool stuff."

If you want other things to be more important than EQ, accept the consequences of that.

*nod* This has always been my philosophy.

The fact that you have priorities in life , over EQ, is great! It's understandable.
But it also means that you should be willing to realize that you can't have your cake and eat it too.


-Noish

[Lickity]

So, what you're saying is that the Aid Grimel quest was designed as a reward for those who can afford the time to put into a large raiding guild. I thought so.

yeah, actually that is what it was designed for. The item is on par with high end EP and even Time earrings. It was meant to recognize the tradeskillers in the high-end of the game. The people without flags aren't always the people who are getting picked on. If you aren't flagged for these zones, put yourself in their shoes. If you are geared in an EP geared guild, and have your tradeskills maxed, with the exception of Aid Grimel, there is no reason for you to have done tradeskills at all.

EQ gave us the shawl quest, the solstice earring quest, both of which are completable by non-flagged, non-raiding people. Both of these items are obsolete in the high end of the game. What you are asking for is to dilute the game entirely, and make no real reason for raiding. As it is the devs are putting EP quality gear in the LDON missions in the near future.

You can consider the raiders elitists all you want, but remember they also are paying for risk/reward. They may have the same number of AA as you do, but they aren't getting any of that on their raids, they are putting in as much time as you to XPing as you ON TOP of raiding.

As I say, I have tried two open raids on the rare weekend days I had some time to play, we got wiped both times, and that was only MB in POI. This weekend I spent about two hours waiting for an open raid on TT cause I was told at 65 I didn't need the Hedge flag to get in. Guess what? They were wrong and I couldn't zone in. How many more open raids like that must I try to attend to get elemental flagged? Well, sorry, I have better things to do and maybe some of them don't involve EQ.

This really irks me, espcially coming from a tradeskiller. You know how to do research, if you allowed "someone" to tell you how to do anything, you are just their tool, there are numerous sites on the internet not only DETAILING progression, but also the strategy on how to beat these mobs. Look them up. In the time it would take you to do 2-3 LDONs, you could have a pickup raid kill one of these bosses, and get yourself a flag. It might take a while to get them all, but you would have what you asked for, a non-time consuming raiding schedule.

Forgive me for this turning into a semi-rant, but it is irritating to to be told that the accomplishments of the few are being threatened by the many who want to do less work to get there. How many of us would be in arms if the tradeskill and drop requirements were reduced on the Shawl quest, probably every single one of us who finished it. The same would be said if Tailoring all of the sudden had a vendor bought path to 250.

[Lickity]

do not mention 'rallos' to noishpa or 'bertoxx' to me. 'raiding/flagging = hard' is relative for each person.

Off topic, but OMG, Bertox event sucks. On our last successful clearing of the event, we had under 20 seconds left when Bert finally dropped.

[Lothay]

This thread is de-railing into rader vs. non-radier play styles.

The "next week" refered to is actually a few weeks past.

Closed.