Craft Augmentations, SOE needs input

[Itzena]

That would be one of the possible pending changes from the EQ summit at the weekend.

[vovinit]

Slightly off topic (only because Maddoc posted here).. was it my imagination, or was part of a sony post within the past couple days saying that augments would be reusable soon?

Man I really hope so I have augmented myself into a corner on alot of my gear. I am at points to where I wanna upgrade but I can't stomach the loss of 700+ adventure points per augment to do so.

[Tishalulle]

A few thoughts:

1) Aug recipes should be able to be made with both one tradeskill, and with many. This allows people who only have skill in one tradeskill to make decent augs, especially as they are leveling up and don't have the plat to pour into many tradeskills. Recipes requiring many tradeskills will be awesome for people like me who are working on (or have) high skill in multiple tradeskills. They would also be awesome for people with only one tradeskill, if the components of the final aug were droppable. Many of us supplement our income by selling components in recipes which require multiple tradeskills. (My husband is a trophied rogue in one of many incarnations, and would love to make augs with his skill, and would also love to make components I could finish with my other tradeskills.)

2) There should be aug recipes at many levels. I'd be sad if they went into the game and required 200+ at the minimum. Of course, the higher the skill needed, or the more skills needed to make an aug, the better it should be. E.g. someone with 100 in pottery could make a +x CHA aug (just a random example of a stat, no idea here what's best for which tradeskills right now, it's too darn hot where I am) and then someone with 180 in pottery could make a +2x CHA aug. Someone with 180 in pottery and 180 in brewing could make a +2x CHA +2x STA aug.

3) There should most definitely be aug recipes for all tradeskills. It just takes a little imagination (as many who've posted before me have proven) to come up with ideas and even justification as to why certain tradeskills should get certain types of aug recipes. And repeatedly, people have given fantastic examples for each tradeskill.

4) Crafted augs should be droppable, but once they are put into an item, the item should become no-drop. I think that it would be better for norrath and the devs if we didn't start selling aug'd items in the bazaar. It sounds like a coding nightmare to implement, and I think it might have weird effects on the economy. Plus, I think personally that it's more fun to customize your armor with augs based on what you need in the game. Not all warriors will need STA, not all enchanters will need CHA, etc. It all depends on what race they are, the starting stats they chose, and their other equipment. I think it will be very important that once a droppable aug goes into an item, the item becomes no-drop. Couple this with the concept that augs might soon become reusable, and whammo, you can aug an item (becomes no-drop), outgrow the aug, pop it out (becomes droppable again), and sell it to someone else who could use it.

Just a few thoughts for now. So glad to hear that new and exciting things might be coming to the world of tradeskilling soon!

[Daitan Niyan]

For baking, would it be possible to make an augment that would make a given food last longer? Not necessarily to put ON food, but to put on an item you have that gives you increased metabolism similar to the AA? Same for brewing

When i read this, the first thing i thought of is preservatives, very funny, actually, and a neat idea. Add preservatives to your Halas 10lb meat pie, makes it high in cholesterol, but dang it lasts forever!

We have progressive tradeskill quests in PoP, why not more similar quests requiring multiple tradeskills for Augments? brew a temper, make a mold with pottery, smith a special metal, JC an jewel to mount in the aug, use tailoring to make a special thread to "filligre" the final design. I mean, the possiblities are wide open. My favorite quests in EQ deal with tradeskills, the Velious era shawl, and coldain ring (not so tradeskill-oriented, but melee's traditionally are difficult to master tradeskills with, especially back in velious) quests were awesome.

I would love to see Quests, along the lines of those Velious Era quests, involving tradeskills in the game. Using augments to implement them, seems like a logical progression.

Regards,

[AbsorEQ]

One of the major problems with tradeskills in the "balance" minds is that it can be "easilly" repeated over and over.

Now as far as I Know, augmenting an item makes it no-drop. So doing, this CAN be used as a way to make an augment a one time purchase, becasue once in the person is "stuck" with it, and cannot sell it.

Augmenting it makes in no-drop because the augment is no-drop. Remember, they gain the restrictions of both items.

Certainly you would want these augs to be tradeable. Right there you have a huge bonus inherent in any sort of tradeskilled aug.

A

[Myrron]

Hm, you know, I had never really thought about why augmented items became no-drop, I just assumed the no-drop tag was an automatic thing. It didn't occur to me it was because 100% of all augments are currently no-drop, though in hindsight it makes perfect sense.

This does put a new twist into making droppable augments. Droppable augments + LDoN (and maybe GoD...not sure what slot types they have) tradeskilled gear = variety. You could have one Gothic BP for sale with a regen 2 augment, another with a FT2 augment, a third with a vengence augment, and of course you have to have the large and small sizes to take into consideration...

--Myrron Lifewarder

[Mark]

My opinion may upset people

I would rather see the augmentations be no-drop. They could be a way that trade skill people could enhance their own equipment, not make a ton of cash. Making the augs no-drop would also lower the contention over the materials used to craft them. People grouping would know that the person rolling on them was actually a trade skiller and that they were not just rolling on a cash item. I am not saying make the raw materials no drop, just the augmentations.

Yes, making a ton of cash is great for some but for the most part it just hurts the economy and is much harder to balance (I assume). Besides, if the best augmentations are crafted AND no-drop than more people will learn the joy of trade skills and there will be more demand to add content to it in the future.

As a side note, I have to say that the tradeskill quests (like Aid Grimill (sp)) are a nice idea, but they still require uber power to complete, and not just a love of trade skills... please don't do that to crafted augmentations.

[zephur]

Maybe make the augment from parts.

Different tradeskills can make a part that. Such as:
Smithing does various hp,str,endur types
Tailoring does various int/wis, mana types
Etc.....

Then however many of these you want to combine is put together in a 8-10 "AugSlot" mold for an augment. i.e. - Item with the current "slots" system, each slot having an aug with "AugSlots" in it.

This would make the augment work the way a current item works with augments on them and limit the number of new items made vs. having a new one for every possible combination.

[Brodder FoamyMugs]

Brewing augments can impart effects of drinking on target with all associated negatives n bonuses... (ala Brells Battle Mug I used to have tht did that via Whirl till you hurl like proc)...

If aug procs then target must make Alcohol tolerance check or face stat changes...and burp loudly as magic forces the beverage into their system by the most expedient means...makes fighting small folks a frightening issue for many mobs in game...

Mob 001- INC ENEMIES....
MOB 2 Looks around corner - OHH CRAP RUN!
MOB001 WE can take them!
Mob 2 THEY'RE STUNTS WITH AUGS RUN WE DON't WANT ENEMAS LIKE THEM!
MOB001 don't you mean Enemies? hey where you go?
...few seconds later...
MOB001 OOOHH ARRGHHH NOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

Sigh where does the mind go at 323 am?


Right clicks are out- but some augs are procs, some are stats, some just could be coloration, and neato looks... (layered augs with no real value but looks designed for player made gear only)

BOB makes a Dwarven double bladed axe for Tommy...
Tommy takes the axe to Doug who puts in the Gold Leaf Galvanization augment giving the weapon a golden glow...
Tommy then takes the axe to Missy who puts in a Gemset augment and the weapon gets perty gems on the haft- OR she could do an ETCHING augment...that puts a neat design onto it.
Tommy then must consider what goes in the last slot- he's got a magic weapon that now glows and looks **** cool...but now he wants it to cause his targets to freeze too....
So he takes his axe to an alchemist and asks for a CHILL CATALYST ...and now his axe will do cold damage or proc a cold DD when it hits!

Or he goes to a Poisoner and asks for a viper augment to make his weapon bite like a snake too when he hits things with it...

Thus he's filled all aug slots in the weapon- two for looks one for proc...stats we're preset already by the recipe and materials used to make the item...

For the last slot he could have asked for essence of speed, vitality or what not from a brewer or even used a proper augment from a mob- but since player made one limited by the crafting and power and nature of the weapon...
IF weapon used TIME drops to forge- it could then use appropriate PLAYER AUG or DROP AUG from time in that slot- EITHER OR! not both...


OKIES off to bed now really...

[Murmullo DelBosque]

Having read the majority of these posts, I love the direction the thread is taking!

I would like to support the comment made by one of my fellow tradeskillers (too lazy to sort back through and find the quote) about making the augments (or adding augments) attainable through tradeskill quests. This is EverQUEST after all. I am slowly pushing to max my tradeskills dispite my familly members and friend thinking I have some sort of disorder and it would be great to see some varied multi tradeskill quests along the lines of the Shawl or Aid Grimel that had augments as rewards.
I fully support the idea of us being able to make our own augments BUT adding some special ones attainable via quests that require many tradeskills (maybe starting as low as 75 trivial in 3 or 4 different trades). I realise that adding entire quests to the game requires it's fair share of coding, testing etc versus taking the NO DROP tag off augments (some of them?) but while we're throwing ideas around... 8)

[Itzena]

Augmenting it makes in no-drop because the augment is no-drop. Remember, they gain the restrictions of both items.

Certainly you would want these augs to be tradeable. Right there you have a huge bonus inherent in any sort of tradeskilled aug.

Is there any way the nodrop code can be changed to 'borrow' an idea from WoW where some items are tradeable until equiped and then become nodrop after that? So the augments would be tradeable until bonded to the item, and then they (and the item) become nodrop after that.

Yes, yes I know you'll have people screaming blue murder "OMG SOE st0led that from Blizzard!!!!11" but it is an elegant solution IMO.

[Ngreth Thergn]

Is there any way the nodrop code can be changed to 'borrow' an idea from WoW where some items are tradeable until equiped and then become nodrop after that? So the augments would be tradeable until bonded to the item, and then they (and the item) become nodrop after that.

Yes, yes I know you'll have people screaming blue murder "OMG SOE st0led that from Blizzard!!!!11" but it is an elegant solution IMO.

Actually I think EQ2 anounced a similar feature before or about the same time as WoW... so we can just say they stole it from EQ2, and leave it in company. (EQ2 calls it "atunable items")

[Thorigarn Grim]

open ended tradeskills

I never really understood why I couldn't throw a gem into my smithing combine to add a stat that was represented by that particular gem. For example, I had always wished I could toss a bloodstone into a combine to add more stamina to banded armor. When PoP introduced raw diamonds that could be imbued by several classes I once again hoped different classes would be able to add properties to various tradeskill items. Instead, the result was a very specific small set of items.

Augmentations have the potential to do just this.

My hopes for augmentations include everyone. Should a SoW potion be hanging from a random piece of armor? No.

Mix a raw diamond with celestial essence and it could become susceptible to magic. But what would happen if a prepared raw diamond was included in the SoW potion recipe? Could a Druid skilled in the abilities of regeneration find a way to cast on a prepared diamond? How about asking a Rogue who is a master of poisons to add his skills to one of these diamonds in order to help someone hide in shadows, or simple be more resistant to the various poisons the Rogue knows so much about? Maybe he could make poisons last indefinitely when applied properly to a stone and then used to augment his weapons?

This thought opens doors for lots of variety in what we already have available.

Could a Necromancer who is skilled in reasearch find a way to bottle the effects of his Lich spell? Casting Lich upon a prepared diamond might make the diamond crumble once it's used. Perhaps when researching the Lich spell he should include a prepared raw diamond and "bottle" the spell in that, rather than on a piece of parchment. Perhaps some of the rare stones from Umbral Plains could be found to have effects useful for the more powerful or desireable enchantments (there's no problem with not having everything you need available at the corner market).

Brief negativity ~ I posted these ideas because I wanted to give alternatives to some of the options we already have implemented. Diety specific imbues could be used as well, but don't give the same level of rewards to everyone, and carry the mark of a god with them. For example rubies are rather expensive and could be imbued (historically) to provide Wisdom and Strength to the worshippers of Brell. While that's nice and all, rubies cost a lot more than emeralds or peridot used by other gods. That also leaves many stones not chosen by gods that have good effects in jewelcraft, such as fire opals.

Sorry for the long post, thank you guys for listening.

Tornik Grimshade / Thorigarn Grim
Echoes in Eternity of Rodcet Nife

[Maevenniia]

....That also leaves many stones not chosen by gods that have good effects in jewelcraft, such as fire opals.

FYI - Fire Opals can be imbued by Wizards who worship Solusek Ro.

[Thorigarn Grim]

okay, yeah sure fine, so I picked a bad example. hope the rest of my post wasn't wasted because of this...