Selling Bags in the Bazaar (Test Server)

[Chenier]

Yeah, the price will drop. But given some time, they will rebound, just like when any new recipe comes out.

I think it'll be great. =)

[Noni DeeCups]

Originally posted by Cragzop
I fully admit - I'm a buyer and not a seller of those bags. I think it's good.

If every race had such a cash cow then I might be more agreeable that it's bad, but haversacks are a cash cow for just a few and it's at the expense of everyone else. As it is the haversacks etc. provide a very viable alternate skillup path that the other races are barred from.

Cash cow? Trivial >250? Tailoring has cost me at least 400k and over 3 years to skill up to 240. All that just so I can what? Make these bags for you at cost? Buy a tink bag if you feel you are being ripped off so bad. Cash cow... that is truely offensive.

These bags are not a skill up path when they cost 3 blue diamonds, 3 platinum threads and 36 tufts fo fur per bag provided you have no fails on sub combines.

If this kills the market I will stop making them, just like I stopped baking.

[zandorian]

Haversacks do sell well but are not a cash cow.

To make in any volume at all you have to buy from bazzar, On my server prices as follows

DIre wolf tufts 50ppx36= 1800
Blue Diamonds 250-300 x3= 750
platimum threads 210 x 3= 730
Misty Acorn 100pp = 100
Misc (acid, Ce, water) 20pp= 20

Total 3300pp

Plus failures either on tufts or Celestial tempers brings price to make around 4000. Plus the odd final combine failure.

sell for 6k means 2k profit per bag. And its not like u can mass produce these, DIre wolf tufts are a pain. Atm theres 15 tufts for sale in bazzar. not even enough for half a bag. I am lucky if I can make 12 bags a week... humm 24k cant even buy a piece of ornate(40-70k) or a spell(30k+ for lvl 65).

like I said I am not complaining just think it will reduce the profit on them.

[splunge]

Minor update:

Bag of Sewn Evil Eye
Hand Made Backpack
Rallic Pack

all presently for sale in Tests bazaar.

[Wolfkind]

I as well don't see the bag tokens as being a good thing. The only people selling the haversacks at that point will be people running forage-bot characters, and collecting the blue diamonds from their guilds.

Prices in my opinion will go to under 3k, and maybe even hit 2k. While this may be a nice thing to see for those that want to buy cheap WR bags, it will kill interest in tailoring for many people who don't bot their characters.

I think that SoE is doing this out of a desire to give something nice to the player base, and that is normally a good thing, but in this case, I hope they will reconsider.

[Dunthor Warsmith]

If the prices go that low (2kpp-3kpp) I really doubt many people will consider them worthwhile to make. Its all driven by what people consider is an acceptable return on investment - sure, if you get someone with a really low value on their own time, or wants to sell at a loss (for whatever reason), then the market can dip extremely low.

The issue is if that person exists. If not, and all the bagmakers have similar "costs" to the 4+ kpp post above (be they in bazaar purchase costs, or time spent making/foraging themselves), then there is a soft bottom for the market up in that range - below 4kpp, the halflings aren't getting any "benifit" from selling the bags, so they're not likely to. Hence the price is liable to stay reasonably high, in the area of the 4-6kpp, dependant on the cost of the lowest-cost individuals who can collectively supply enough haversacks to meet demand.

Its all dependant on not having one of the extremely-low-cost folks in the group.

Its probably at least somewhat reasonable to compare the haversack market to the Blue Diamond cultural armor market. The raw cost for most pieces is generally somewhere around ( 300pp (BD) + 30pp (ench lrg brk) + 100pp (block of vel) ) * (number of sheets) + 100-500pp (temper) + 50pp (jointing & misc) ~= 600pp-1900pp. Yet most of the BD plate cultural in the bazaar is priced in the 4kpp-20kpp. The prices have stayed above cost. I would imagine its, at least in part, a combination of time to actually do the combines, their race restricted nature, and the skill required for a reasonable success rate. Similar qualities are true of the Haversacks as well.

Personally, I'm looking forward to the token system going live. It will give me an opportunity to hopefully actually *find* some lemming fur backpacks for sale, and make acquiring more haversacks not such a waiting game hoping to find someone selling them while you're around. On the more minor side, it would also let me sell handmades and quivers, which probably will be pretty cheap but still something useful to people and profitable.

[eniamn]

do tokens stack? that would rule but would be awesome anyway if they don't.

[Daeguard]

I had a thought last night, do LORE bags result in a LORE token?

[Twistagain]

If the LORE tag doesn't copy over, I guess we can kiss the idea of EVER finding the Grimling Runner uncamped by a druid.

As for the "ruining the market" aspect...yes, doubling your investment is a cash cow. If you can't mass produce them, then what difference does it make to you if the profit is reduced or not?

Should they be cheaper than Tink Bags? No, I don't believe they should. But, being a Vah Shir tradeskiller, I don't believe that Halfling Druids should be the only tailors able to make money at the skill...

[eniamn]

robe of tempest is selling well for erudite tailors. i am one but no where near the skill or level to make the robes. also you cant really farm any research drop so it makes it harder to get them.

[Maisie]

Originally posted by Twistagain
I don't believe that Halfling Druids should be the only tailors able to make money at the skill...

*cough


I am a Cleric, just to clarify

[DeegerStormcrow]

I disagree that this will be a bad thing. Sure, some tailors will lose profit margin but then they don't have to spend a lot of time shilling their bags, either. ProfitMargin X Time will be roughly the same.

The market won't be flooded because:
a) They are not a viable skillup path (too expensive and acorns are bloody rare). Items are usually sold "at cost" when they are a skillup path.
b) The bags won't become obsolete so people won't be dumping them for upgrades. (Provided SOE doesn't create 12-slot bags in future expansions )

[Meriru]

Other bags?

Has anyone seen if other bags are available this way? (that is, non-WR containers like the Blackburrow Cask?)

As a side not to my question, I think the market will initially fall on WR bags like Haversacks, but in the long run the price will depend on how many people are willing and able to make them and what they price the bags at--I bought rallic packs for my characters at 500pp each (on Firiona Vie) around 6 months ago; now they're selling between 800 and 1200... Why? Because nobody is willing to camp the mobs anymore. Even if Haversacks drop initially, they will go back up in the longrun either because fewer people will sell them or more people will want them--remember, the sellers aren't the only people who have to sit in POK or Nexus or Bazaar shouting, the buyers have to run around shouting too until there is a meeting of buyer/seller. This reduces the time-cost to both parties and thus helps both--buyers get a cut in price (maybe) and sellers can save TIME, thus spending more time getting ingredients to make more bags, thus more revenue (if not more profit).
But that's just the ramblings of an economics lover =)

Meriru
Firiona Vie

[Wolfkind]

No reason why bags would stay 4k+ considering that there are many people that now run bots of various kinds, including forage bots inside thurg. The reason I know about it, is because I have bought massive amounts of tufts from one of them, and although he doesn't claim to be a bot, he is on 24/7 and rarely answers a tell, plus there are times when I am looking to buy from him and he needs me to hurry because he is about to leave the comp for the day (but the character remained loged in after he left, still accumulating tufts).

If I was looking to cheat, I would arrange to buy all the guild blue diamonds at 239pp instead of them selling to vendors, run a forage bot, and make haversacks at a record pace, sticking them on a trader mule, probably reducing my price to keep all the competition away.

True cost of haversacks with that kind of an assembly line running would be ...

tufts - 0pp
blue diamonds 239x3 - 717pp
Plat thread 209x3 - 627
acorns - 50pp
misc - 20pp

completed haversack would be about 1414pp assuming no failures.

2-3kpp makes for a tidy little profit when you run it that way, and I think you can count on some people doing just that very thing since they do it already in other aspects of the game, such as the buff bots that are in PoK 24/7


I can understand how everyone that doesn't tailor would love to have 100% WR bags at low cost, but if that is the goal they should just put tinkerers bags on normal merchants, and reduce the price from 5250, to 1k or so. speaking for myself, I hope this doesn't go live.

[Yakk]

Haversacks have massive price support.

Check the sell price on tink bags. Last I checked, it was 4750 pp.

If haversacks get cheaper than 4750, people will sell tink bags and buy (better) haversacks and end up with extra pp.