What feature would you like on EQTC.

[Nolrog]

How about adding a new forum for augments. Otherwise, each of the various boards will get augment posts on them (or all the augment posts will be put on the general forum.) I do see the overlap though, since it's not really a tradeskill in itself, but uses other tradeskils to make. I'm thinking that having one place to consolidate them would be a good idea.

[Dunthor Warsmith]

Since this would probably involve changing the data type I'm not optimistic about this actually happening, but could the stackability of an item differentiate between "not stackable" and "No stackability information yet"? (ie, 3 values: {stackable, not stackable, no info}, versus the current two of {stackable, blank})

[Sanna]

not that i know how the data form looks... but i imagine it to be a series of check/radio boxes...

if the "stackable" question were
(radio)-stackable (radio)-non-stackable

could you code the page that we see to just show the value, no matter what? then we'd know what the DB knows and what could use updating?



you know what would be /very/ interesting (tho probably only to a small set of people : p)? if you had a 'blank' version of whatever method you use to update item information. Like, a static display of, say, the Misty Thicket Picnic item page. It just crossed my mind that I'd probably use a lot less of those hedging phrases (ok, this /is/ me, so just a few less) if I knew what was and was not possible with the current setup.

that, and it would just be interesting to see.

-- Sanna

[Krazick]

Currently the flags "Magic", "Lore", "No Drop", "Stackable", "Attuneable" are just YES/NO Flags... we don't really have an "Unknown" status for them. It might be more reasonable if we did have an unknown... but going back and retro-fitting might be more trouble than it is worth.

[Ngreth Thergn]

well... I change that form so often, it would be another chore just showing it

But yes, for those particular "flag" like items there are no unknowns, just yes/no so you see exactly what the DB sees. if it says stackable, that is what the DB sees, if it does not say stackable, again, you see what the DB sees since there are only 2 choices it is only where there is "freeform" data or multiple posibility data where they may be an unknown

with a very few exceptions, for some data that is purly internal use (like what items should not show all recipes in the tree) I use "if (flag) show" type statements, which gives me only 2 posible results, something is printed in the output or not. Because of that, you can explecitly tell by what is displayed what the database knows

[Sanna]

nono, i didn't mean to ask for a retrofit of something.... i just find myself wondering if i speak close enough to the same language as the DB for what i think up to make sense in a real context.

I also find myself wishing again for something akin to the "chat-threads" on alla's... where people could leave notes attached directly to the item itself, stating updates.... but knowing that I know nothing, I know I can barely begin to imagine the coding "fun" that would be, so... I keep dreaming : p.

With linkbots like Tyking running, and in game links easy-as-peas to find now, virtually any right-click info you want can be found (and filled in)... and /that/ makes me wish for some kind of (probably limited-access?) search function for what's not known. Of course, in THAT vein of thought... what /isn't/ known anymore? Even the ldon slots on the older items looking like they're beginning to be filled in... so it's mostly cosmetic now?

I guess that would apply more if you were going to go back and sweep through the /entire/ DB and add a whole field to all/most items.... like the ldon slots, or the guy up there who mentioned trib values.
Thinking about trib values makes me think, "well, lucy already does trib..."
Which makes me think, "can't they just provide a link from each item to lucy? I mean, lucy has standard link formats... but they'd need to know EQID... and wasn't the whole Tyking thing started with that (associating eqtc-ids with the eqids) in mind?"
Is /that/ still on any kind of burner anywhere, to factor in 'tyking-data'?

... was that train of thought legible at all?

-- Sanna

edit: between the things I think about and the, what, four months I wasn't here... and the fact that I only actually post about 1/5th of the entries I type (ie, I have memory of 'saying' something that you never saw)... it's really possible I'm saying, ie suggesting, something two or three times. Don't let me harp, ie nag, on something too much. watashi hitotsu dake, soremo dake bourei.

[Krazick]

As for legible thoughts... yes I think I follow it mostly

As for items "missing" or "unknown" we do have a couple of folks scouring through the old items, updating augment slots (as you noticed)... and we are begining to see people noting that our recipes don't always show all of the containers a recipe can be made in...

Quick, off the top of your head (no peeking) can you name all of the different containers that you can make bows in? Or how about making a pair of leather boots?

The number of tradeskill containers that recipes can be created in is rather large... crossed with the number of recipes... it gets a bit overwhelming... and there is no in-game way to link a recipe to verify that each and every tradeskill container can in reality actually properly make the item. They all have to be tested invididually to be sure.

Or take another item... What are all the different hides that can be used to make a Poison Vial?

As for Chat-threads about items... actually I would call it more a forum type thread since it hangs around forever. And I am sure we don't want to estabilish something like that, because the cost of maintaining all of that would just be excessive.

Keep the ideas comming... they stimulate thoughts... (and this caused me to think of something I will discuss more with Ngreth first)

[Eileah]

This may not be the place to ask this, but here goes...

If I put it in the wrong place I apologize =)

I am curious what the criteria is for adding items to the database, let me give you examples so you can see why I am confused.

Lock of Siren Hair

On this thread the item was submitted because it has a TS tag, but was not added because there is no (known) recipe using it, but in the thread it is mentioned that Drachnid Silk is tracked because it is foraged. I assume that is because the forage listing is all inclusive, having both tradeskill and non-tradeskill items in it, it simply has ALL forages... correct?

But then I was searching for Carapace and the list contained two items that are not used in tradeskills, are not foraged, and iirc do not have a TS tag on them ingame.

So I confused as to what exactly the standard is, is it a TS tag, a known recipe, a reference ingame to it being TS usable?

If I should ask this question somewhere else just point me in the right direction =)

Thanks,

[Krazick]

Eileah,

Reasonable question. Let me see if I can answer:

1. If an Item is Fished, Foraged, or Ground Spawn it gets added regardless of it's use. We have specific lookups and tables for them.
2. If an Item is made from a Recipe, using a Tradeskill Container (ie not just a Quest Container) it is added.
3. If an Item is known to be used in a Recipe (not a quest container) it is added.

After this it gets a bit... fuzzy.
4. If an Item is known to be used in a "Newbie" quest, it gets added.
5. If an Item is a reward for a Tradeskill Quest, it gets added.

We rarely, if ever, pay attention to the "used in Tradeskills" tag, since it has always been rather flakey in which items were tagged, and which were not. Even with new expansions, and new items they have been rather shoddy about properly tagging items.

We don't have everything that meets these qualifications in the database yet, but we keep plugging away at them.

This help any?

[Verdandi]

I suspect that there are also times where someone submits an item that really isn't needed for tradeskills, and the person doing the data entry knows this and notes the post as such and moves on without adding the item. Then another post is made with another such item, but the data entry person doesn't happen to know the item isn't used in tradeskills and goes ahead and adds it.

I can see that happening very, very easily.

[Tudani]

We also used to add various pelts and things that weren't tradeskill useable but that people often thought might be. That way they'd be less likely to ask on the boards about it. Most of that is leftover from either the static site or right when the database went in. We do however occationally add something like that.

[Eileah]

This help any?

Yes, made things much clearer

Thanks for taking the time to explain it so well =)

[Cujoy]

I know a very simple request and would be awesome for the rabid tradeskiller! How about a Firefox search engine plug in? I know someone has made one for Lucy and AllaKhazam's.

[Ngreth Thergn]

<-- knows nothing of Firefox

[KyrosKrane]

On the reverse recipe search (the page you get to when clicking "Find recipes that use this item"), would it be possible to add a title above the search results saying something like "Recipes that use Foobar"? This would be useful if a person bookmarks the page then forgets why they did it. Right now, the only way to figure out specifically what item is being searched on is to scan the ingredients list and try to figure it out manually. Making the name link back to the item itself would be gravy.

On a related note (and I don't know if this is possible, given the way paging currently works), would it be possible to add a "page X of Y" thing to the "next 25" and "previous 25" buttons on that page?

Oh, and about Firefox: http://www.mozilla.org/products/firefox/