New Tradeskill UI on Test

[Collwyn]

I'm not flaming you but it sounds more to me like you don't like the idea of someone having it easier then you. It's a basic human reaction to change in many people but you should really sit back and rethink it. How can you find endless clicking a remote effort.[/B]

I think this is right on the money. The one thing that people seem to forget is that SOE is always trying to make the game more "user friendly" and easier for someone to jump in and play. It makes sense...that's how they make money.

Create a new character. I don't know about you folks, but I don't remember starting the game fresh and having a weapon skill of 5, maxed direction sense, maps of the zones, and indicators over merchants/guild masters heads etc.

Yeah, the game is easier than it was when it first came out....and you know what? I'm willing to bet it continues to get easier to some extent. I'm completely ok with that....and if this UI is any example...at least it's a change that will make things easy for me too!!

[andyhre]

Here is my thought experiment for the day.

If you are a GM of a skill, would you accept 150% (inflation-adjusted if eed be)of what it cost you to go from 0 to 250 and revert to zero, so you can re-GM using the supposedly trivially easy new UI?

If no, why not? The annoyance of farming? The tedium?

[Arghargh]

Ok, granted they'll likely be in the minority, but some people will be less likely to use or like the new trade skills UI.

With the current system, you are actually doing something. It requires attention, and good hand eye coordination to do combines quickly. You need to manage your inventory slots help minimize the mouse movements, and thus speed up the movement of items.

With the new system, you find a recipe, click to combine, wait (lots of this), and hit /autoinventory. Repeat ad nauseum. This is boring by comparison. This is about as much fun as swimming in a circle raise that skill, or casting a level one spell to raise those skills (abjurtion, etc.). After doing this several thousand times to GM one skill, I think some players will be so unbearably bored that they won't even consider GM a second skill, much less all of them.

Arghargh Grumble, Darkblood
65 Ogre Shaman of Rallos Zek

200 Alchemy
221 Baking
250 Blacksmithing
250 Brewing
200 Fishing
200 Fletching
200 Jewelry
200 Pottery
170 Tailoring

[JMorgana]

Just a note for those saying "I would buy GoD just for the tradeskill UI", the last I saw on Sony's website was that the UI was going in with the GoD patch, NOT that it was only going to be available to people with GoD. I wouldn't think it would be GoD only or else why would they be testing it on test server and not just beta...am I missing something here?

[Kieroth_whiteleaf]

Hypothetically, let's just *assume* that the tradeskill UI will make *EVERYONE* want to be a GM tradeskiller (which I disagree with, but it doesn't matter).

Farming is the block. It's been said before, will undoubtably be said again.

Yes- you can buy stuff in the bazaar if you have snotloads of cash. Sorta.

Getting up to GM in baking/brewing/jc/fletching is *ALREADY* trivial. I mastered all of them in a few hours for only a hundred or two plat, and **** close to GMming for not much more. The obstacle for *ME* isn't the clicking - it's getting the cash for the combines.

Tailoring - The viable route is usually reinforced acrylia and/or solstice robes. Both of which require farming or bazaar trips. OMG. This could destabilize the economy.

On my server I don't recall a time when there's ever been more than 1000 flawless hides around. Which leads to about 50 skillups, given the 1/20 ratio.

Dear god. ONE more GM. And if they're powerskilling like that, odds are they have some specific goal in mind rather than being one of the "I want to sell for profit" type tradeskillers, so that *ONE* person isn't likely destabilizing the economy, it just means that ONE potential suit of tailored armor isn't going to sell.

The powerskilled tradeskiller USUALLY just vendor feeds his wares, so all those acrylia masks that we were selling for 15-30pp are now going for a hair more off a vendor. PROBABLY the tailoring vendor.

IF someone is waiting for THIS UI thinking that it's the ONLY reason they were gonna tradeskill, they're looking for a quick fix. They're not the type that is going to be hanging around in the bazaar trying to LIVE off tradeskills. They're just going to get it done with and move onto the latest fad.

In smithing it's largely the same story, only even harder - the people who didn't have the patience to farm hollowshade, the money for cultural or the money for sickles is STILL not going to have the patience for hollowshade, the money for sickles or the money/time for cultural.

Yeah, I'm going to wait a week before finishing up my MHB run in brewing, so I can do it with the new UI. But I'd have done it anyways.

I'm not going to GM smithing tomorrow. I'm not even going to GM it next week with the new UI. I don't have the PP/time necessary to do it.

Realistically, the people who weren't going to do it before aren't going to do it now. Maybe a couple, but if a couple people can singlehandedly (doublehandedly?) destabilize the economy, it's not the UI's fault - it's the badly set up economy.

For me in smithing (at 192) my roadblock is that I'm low on cash (~1k usually) and don't have the LDoN forages. And when I FINALLY make it to 250 (with or without the UI) I'm not going to be destabilizing any economy - My guild already doesn't buy smithed items in the bazaar, they won't after I'm done. I don't sell in the bazaar because I have better things to do with my processor cycles than spend them standing around.

The powerskillers will still buy CE's in the Bazaar, just like they always did. It's only a few clicks now, it's not like they're saving their poor wrists by cutting out those (2?) extra clicks. If they didn't want to take the time to vendor buy the components, break out the M&P and combine before, they *STILL* won't.

Personally, I think ANYONE who would buy CE's for 5pp each is insane.

I had someone pay me 500pp for 200 metal bits. That's crazy. Cost me 20pp and about a half hour to make (was chatting at the same time) - the person who paid that is *STILL* gonna pay that because they want to save that effort.

*AND* - I agree with whoever above said that tradeskills' value shouldn't be based on the fact they cause CT/RSI. Does anyone else think that line of thinking is *INSANE*? I work a psyche rotation. Anyone who thinks that their self-worth is based on self-inflicted harm is a nutjob. When we get a case like that, we *HAVE* to refer them up to an agency that is more qualified to deal with that type of *ILLNESS*.

And just one more, to be spiteful -

If you're getting RSI/CT from doing tradeskills, you either have the wrong mouse or you're holding it wrong. I am constantly on the computers. I *HAVE* CT. The *REASON* I have CT is because when I was YOUNGER I didn't follow good posture/behavior/etc. I do now, and despite the amount of time I work on computers, play games and master tradeskills on all *15* of my alts my condition hasn't gotten any worse. The people who have other issues (like arthritis) have a right to complain, but if you have severe CT it's not because you're a tradeskiller, it's because you're doing something wrong. In my firm if people aren't following ergonomics, they get warnings then they get fired, because I will *NOT* have anyone working for me that's gonna get me into an L&I claim later.

JMT,

Grimm

[Verdandi]

Unstickying this, as feedback about the functioning of the UI has pretty much ceased.

[Quiloue]

THE STORY OF THE STACK OF ARROWS:


R click open fletching kit "Crap there's stuff in it, gotta make some room". *munches down a stack of vegetables* click, click, click, click....
"Still too much stuff, gotta go to bank"... click, click, click, click, click...
"Ok inventory re-arranged, fletching kit clear, click and drag to a convenient spot, that's good"...
"R click open bag with fletching ingredients, click and drag, good"...
"Crap the ingredients are all in different bags, got to arrange them in a nice row".... 8-12 clicks later... "ok looking good, ready to do some work now"...

"click arrowhead... crap, forgot to hold down ctrl... click to close slider-qty bar"...

"okay lets try that again", ctrl-click arrowhead... click to drop...
click shaft, click to drop
click fletch, click to drop
click nock, click to drop, click to combine.... "alright, I have made something new, i'm a badass... okay next..." click to deposit in auto-inventory...

click arrowhead, click drop
click shaft.... "****, the arrowhead didn't drop on the previous click and now I've switched it with a stack of shafts..." click to redeposit shafts and exchange for arrowhead again... click to drop... "alright, gotta avoid that in the future..."

click fletch, click drop
click nock, click drop, combine... "cool", click to auto-inv..

click arrowhead, click drop, click shaft, click... "**** I missed, "Do I want to drop my bundled wooden arrow shaft on the ground? No, i Don't" click No, click to drop...
click fletch, click drop
click groove, click drop
clik combine... "****!... I hit "Done" instead of "Combine" and closed my fletching kit, that's great..." R click to reopen, click combine, click auto-deposit

click point, click drop
click shaft, click drop
click fletch "man my ****ing wrist is killing me" *Shifts in chair* click drop
click nock, click drop
click combine

"yeah, I know the raid is starting dickheads, i'll be right there... i'm a friggin ranger i need these friggin arrows, ******..."

*Clicks faster*
click point, click drop, click shaft , click drop, click fletch, click drop, click nock, pick up the whole stack of nocks, putting a still-attached fletch in its place...


****!!

click, click, click, okay fixed that... and click combine.... r click to re-open fletching kit that you just closed by accident again *grrrr* click combine... massage wrist... "m'kay"

click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click combine.... "futher mucker, the combine i just made appeared in my fletching kit..." *muches more vegetables... throws some **** on the ground* click, click, click, click.....

"yes, I know i'm late for the raid, ******, I'm commming!!!"

click, click, click, click, click, lcik,, clicc, ccilckc ,c ocilc.c.... ffuccck!!

clickc, click, cllckci, click, click, click, click, click, click.... *shakes pain out of wrist* click click click click click clickc clicklc ilckc clicl cl


(Several dozens of clicks later).... ah, 200 arrows, lucky me. I'll probably blow through those on the first 2 mobs.... *limps to raid, trying to steer with left hand*




THE STORY OF A STACK OF ARROWS UNDER NEW UI:

r-click to open fletching window
click to hit desired recipe
click combine
click auto-inv

"Aaaahhhh..."
*thinks on Sony adoringly and wonders why he's in a minority*

[eniamn]

best way i've seen to put it yet lol. so appropriate. defective mouse that doesn't click all the time can so screw you up doing tradeskills.

[myrdale]

OMG

OMG i love this. Will save alot of time since i will not have to look recipes up every time i go to make something. Only real problem i see with it is for people who use tradeskill containers in their inventory or in their bank. Will be a BIG push for tailor made bags i do believe very soon!

[andyhre]

I believe that you can set it so that you can open a tradeskill container for tradeskill use with one type of click and for stoagre with a 2nd type of click.

So we'll need to learn a new habit, but after that the deluxe toolboxes will not mock your lack of tinkering ability on a daily basis.

[Aavar]

control right click opens up trade skill bag normally

[ddubois]

So this goes live with GoD then? I was dissapointed it wasn't in the last patch, but I can wait another week for sure. I'm so looking forward to this! Hopefully I'll be able to get my 240 in baking, fletching and smithing within a week of this going in.

Blacksmithing 212, Brewing 250, Jewellery 250, Pottery 188, Tailoring 131, Fletching 202, Baking 239

[Brildary]

Oh Tanise, I nearly split a gut

This post was so great!! I was crying tears with laughter! Amen! Your recital of the early days of tradeskilling had me dying!! I am so awestruck by the veterans of this beastly mean street we're on, I can never express it fully. Man, you all are so tough. And howlingly funny. Your post just lit me up!! Thanks...and wonderful work.

[Fakinay]

Ok, first of am I one of a few grown ups responding to this? "It's not fair" and "they should have to do it the hard way" comments makes you wonde. Come on peeps, it's 2004. If you want to play "games" with that mentality then hey, why stop progress there. Let's go back to "staring at a book" while medding, or non-stackable items or how bout we revert back to the original game, without the expansions.

To put it bluntly, how bout anything we "the original players" EVER said, "Gawd, I wish they would make this better!" , be put back, because gawd help us if the new players to EQ should have it any easier tha the rest.

I, like many of you, have slaved until my hand was shaking uncontrolably, getting my skills past 100, then 200. So freakin what if some n00b will have it a little easier, GET OVER IT, and move on.

And hey, I know this might be mute, but i'nt it nice that if you decide to start a new toon, things would be a little more up-to-date??


Fakinay Druid of the 58th season.

[Marteeny]

All the buttons I push and clicks I have to do in a group are too tedious.

Can we please make a new hotkey?

It would be different for each class. For me, as an Enchanter, It will perform the following with one click of the button.

Cast mind buffs on group
Cast haste on melee
tash and slow mobs (mez any adds of course)
Nuke and charm as mana permits

This is so many clicks and buttons that it makes me tired. Why can't we make one button to do it all?

I can't even imagine being a bard.