New Tradeskill UI on Test

[eniamn]

actually if they have it set up to where i can just click a cursor 20 times to make a stack of ce i dont mind no stacks. assuming contrl key taped down its like 180 click per stack of ce after containers are open and all that jazz.

[vision500]

Originally posted by Ainyan Dar`Mori
I couldn't read through all of these threads. Too many of them were people whining about how 'easy' SOE was making it for people. It's not 'easy'. What made tradeskilling easy was EQTraders.

As for the new interface, I like it. I'd like to see an option to autoinventory whatever is on your cursor. I pray you impliment the making of stacks. I'll love you forever if you do.

Stop worrying about what this will do to your monopoly. What stopped people from jumping in wasn't the tradeskill... it was the ingredients. And they're still a pain to get.

I'll jump in again to point out a few of the flaws I perceive with this argument (this is only my personal opinion).

1) You need to read ALL of the messages in this thread. Aside from a few posts most are very well thought out expressions of what people are feeling. I'm starting to notice a lot of people restarting points that have been already expressed before.

2) I agree EQTraders made tradeskilling easier, but this isn’t in the same boat.

3) I like the new interface too. I would love to see an auto-inventory / auto-destroy check box available to the user. Along the lines of this thought I had a chance to try out the interface last night (making Fish Rolls) and I think its appropriate to only add the recipe to your available recipes once you have made an item, of course that part was somewhat broken so I didn’t get to test it further.

4) What stopped people from doing Tailoring was the ingredients, Jewelry Making, Brewing, Pottery, Smithing, these can all be done store bought up to about 200 ish (and JM can go to 250+). Please, try to convince me that Jewelry Making isn’t 5 times easier.
(5 clicks down to 1)

-Cory
ps. Can they even make a multi-mod trophy/item? I would think the current item set-up is limited to only being able to mod one skill at a time

[Ainyan Dar`Mori]

What stopped people from doing Tailoring was the ingredients, Jewelry Making, Brewing, Pottery, Smithing, these can all be done store bought up to about 200 ish (and JM can go to 250+). Please, try to convince me that Jewelry Making isn’t 5 times easier.

Wrong. JC, Brewing, and Fletching are the only three tradeskills that you can get GM with without farming ingredients. Smithing is the second hardest tradeskill to get up, next to tailoring, and requires extensive farming of difficult to get items and rare components. (If you know of a recipe that allows you to hit even 220 without farming, share.) Pottery isn't quite as bad, if you're an enchanter, but if you're not, you have to bug enchanters to imbue things and make mana for you. And it has a lot of multi-step combines that this interface does NOT make easier.

There are already a disproportionate amount of GM Brewers and JCers out there. It's cheap, and it's easy. All the clicks in the world have not stopped people from raising those two to GM status first.

[vision500]

Originally posted by Ainyan Dar`Mori
Wrong. JC, Brewing, and Fletching are the only three tradeskills that you can get GM with without farming ingredients. Smithing is the second hardest tradeskill to get up, next to tailoring, and requires extensive farming of difficult to get items and rare components. Pottery isn't quite as bad, if you're an enchanter, but if you're not, you have to bug enchanters to imbue things and make mana for you. And it has a lot of multi-step combines that this interface does NOT make easier.

There are already a disproportionate amount of GM Brewers and JCers out there. It's cheap, and it's easy. All the clicks in the world have not stopped people from raising those two to GM status first.

I never clamed that you could get to GM status with anything but JM, but you can get to near 200 level with the others listed. (If you need I can site example)

And I'm not saying that there isn't more Jeweler's & Brewer's, I'm just saying that for an (easy) tradeskill, its now much easier. Measured at 5 times easier (unless they go with auto-inventory, then it will be 6 times).

-Cory

[Mumboh]

You can only measure it at 5 times easier if you assume PP is not an issue. That is probalby true if you are level 65. It is almost certainly true if you are already a GM in another tradeskill.

However, I restarted on a new server. I am level 20, and PP is very much an issue. I have not even started JC yet (despite desperately needing some +INT items).

I've had to make the decision whether to hang on too all 11 stacks of spiderling silks I've been saving for smithing or to sell some to buy spells. Spells won out.

Tradeskills are not just for level 65 characters (at least most of them aren't and, IMO, none of them should be). And the ONLY signifcant difference between the 3 stacks of fish rolls I made last night and 20 attempts at Star Ruby steins in my previous life is that I could sell the steins for a profit, whereas I'm just going to eat the fish rolls. The took an equivalent dent out of my bank account. My wrists hurt just as much. And I got the same degree of satisfaction.

[Zellidon]

Wrong. JC, Brewing, and Fletching are the only three tradeskills that you can get GM with without farming ingredients. Smithing is the second hardest tradeskill to get up, next to tailoring, and requires extensive farming of difficult to get items and rare components. (If you know of a recipe that allows you to hit even 220 without farming, share.)

Smithing: Mistletoe Cutting Sickles - Trivial > 250 - All components buyable in Shadowhaven for starters

[Mumboh]

There's also:

Pottery: Star Ruby Encrusted Stein, trivial > 250, all ingredients store bought

Edit: I think we're wasting a lot of bandwith on a minority case. The only people we have to worry about tradeskills getting easier for are people who (a) have 10s of thousands of PP, and (b) are interested in tradeskills. But who are those people? Us, the people who are already GM in one tradeskill. IMO, planar AA was more responsible for GM inflation than the new UI will be.

[Cragzop]

I'm looking forward to the new UI. So much so that I'm torn.

I'm at 195 in tailoring and have the major supplies for 200 or so solstice robes. Tailoring is the last tradeskill left for me to GM. I really want to get it done, both for being able to say "Ding 1750" and to go out and do the Gimmel earring quest (I swore to my self that I'd 1750 first).

I had thought about trying to finish it before the new UI went live, ensuring that I'd never have to suffer through anyone saying "You had it easy" etc. but the new UI looks so slick and those 2000 combines for just the robes so painful that the UI has me rethinking.

Same thing on food, I'm low atm. I was going to make a session woth of MTPs. Now I'm thinking about iron rations for a few weeks.

I'm a bit worried about the recipies. I don't want to have to do every possible combine to get a complete library. I'm hoping I read the thread wrong and all the standard recipies that I can trivially do will get loaded automatically.

One suggestion I'd make would be to have the delay between combines be made a function the difference between you and its trivial. Way beneath you, no delay - no real need to add combining of stacks at a time, 20 clicks with no delay is almost as good. Reasonable delay (5 or so sec) when your skill and the trivial are close. And a rather significant delay (15 or even 30 sec)when an item is way above your skill.

This would add something back into getting GM, time. In my opinion being a GM tradeskiller shouldn't be about how many clicks you've done or how much PP you spent but rather about the time to do it. TO me it has value because I took the time to do it, time I could have used to get more AA, more plat, more whatever. I sacrificed for it and so it matters to me.

The only issue I see with the time delay being large for items well above you would be those that have a trivial above 250. But then again with the exception of Kaladim Constitutionals I can't think of any plus 250 trivial item I routinely make by the stackful.

[eniamn]

lol. PICNICS. i am prolly waiting on my next run of picnics too. i went and made a stack of fish rolls though. at 250 baking i try to never eat vendor food anymore on principle. (running out of food was hilarious to me though.) i think 15 seconds is a little extreme.
my pride comes from making the items i or a bud will use. very little pride is eletist for me so i don't mind this as much as some others for that reason i guess. (i look forward to it. it helps me make stuff.) if my picnic profit is cut in half but i cna get a run done in 1 hour instead of three i am all for this. gave away the last of my picnics to friends/guildies/random newbies so i dont really ts for profit. like the money but its a pride in craftsmanship thing for me.

[Kellaen]

All I have to say is

good lord, I can't wait. Even tho i'm done with all but tailoring I'm not bitter at all. Thumbs up

[Kaaba]

Smithing: Mistletoe Cutting Sickles - Trivial > 250 - All components buyable in Shadowhaven for starters

I must have missed where to buy imbued emeralds....

[Renjah]

I assume they meant the emeralds are buyable but need to be imbued

[eniamn]

many here have leveled druid to 29 just to imbue emeralds.

with enchanting can get to 250 smithing on pure enchanted velium bar from ag quest. about 700pp perr combine and no sell back.

[TheGiantOne]

When I mentioned a possible 10000 tradeskillers on each server I am not jealous and I don't think I own any type of monopoly in tradeskilling.

I am sure that myself and the majority of the GM Tradeskillers will wait and see what happens.

Main problem is lack of materials and being price gouged by others from selling them in the bazaar. Changes to the drops have made this worse.

I won't go into long detail but what has messed up the pricing on end items are not what you called "monopoly tradeskillers". Its the number/frequency of drops of needed materials which then produced price gouging in the bazaar on these materials. When the prices of materials go up the price of your ending item goes up. We as GM Fletchers on Povar at one time had Elemental Bows down to around 80k so the average person could afford them but now they are all the way back up to 125k or better.

Why? LOL Vines cost 13k x 2 = 26k and a Stonewood Staff 20k so thats 46k. 33% success ratio you need 138k to make that certain bow (in the past cost were 54k for 3 attempts on same bow). Instead of making them myself I do combines for others.

GM Tradeskillers do work together to keep the markets as low as possible for buyers of items and we help up and coming tradeskillers in whatever skill with information.

One last thing. The Aid Grimel originally started out as a TRADESKILL QUEST as a reward for all the hard work to accomplish getting GM's in most of the skills. Take it out of the upper elemental planes please for those of us who don't belong to uber guilds.

I as well as many others want whats best for the tradeskilling and buyer community's. I hope this interface will do great things and that also the economy balances out again.

[Cayleu Starshine]

I support the new UI, speaking as a GM of all tradeskills.

Actually, let me rephrase that. I do not support the change. I am not happy about the change. However, I dont see a point in opposing it anymore, I'm apathetic and a little disgusted.

I understand the arguement that this trivializes tradeskills, and for those of you saying that it doesnt, you do not have proper perspective, its not about the effort, its the rarity. You mostly receive pride from Grandmastering skills because it makes you stand out, not many people do it. After this change, everyone and their dog will GM the first 5 tradeskills in days, with tailoring/smithing soon to follow.

Now you announce in guild you GM a skill, you are congratulated. Give it some time, and your guild will either not care, or they may laugh at you, asking why it took you so long, since 100 others in your guild have GM'd that skill already. It will destroy the accomplishment and pride you may have felt had you GM'd the long way like the rest of us did, simply because you would have been unique. Now, no one will care what you did in your spare TV-watching blind-button-pushing time.

Despite all of that, I support (rephrase, I do not strongly oppose) the UI change. Why? I already achieved what I want from tradeskills, so there wont be a loss of accomplishment, I did it already.

The tradeskill economy will be ruined? Too late. You cant make money on tradeskills anymore already, except elemental stuff, and then the limit will be ele access, not the tradeskills.

If this UI change would have been proposed 18 months ago when the tradeskill economy was still vibrant and healthy, I would have been EXTREMELY opposed to trivializing the tradeskills. At this point though, I dont care anymore, we already have too many tradeskill GM's now, the economy has already been ruined. An extra massive flood of new trade GM's will no longer make a difference. Unless of course GoD introduces some new recipes that could have been profitable, but will in reality be rendered break-even within days when 100's of GM's all compete for the same market, then this will all be a sad shame.