Alchemy idea: Rez potions

[DerekSaganii]

As an alternative, how about a potion that simply teleports you to your corpse? Same rules as CotH in terms of whether or not it works including that the potion won't disappear if you try to use it when your corpse is in a blocked area. No rezz at all (or 0% I guess).

An alternative could be "force corpse to Shadow Rest." Drink it and your corpse is summoned to Shadow Rest immediately. No Rezz, just like summon corpse but for the rest of us. I think this would really help in zones where you can't easily get your corpse (Fear, Sky, Hate, etc...) and not unbalance anything because it's going back to a specific place away from any kind of useful content.

[Madriu]

I have a bit of a problem with this, unless the potions are just so expensive that you won't be able to keep a steady supply unless your guild funds it.

Why?

In the latest expansions, it has become harder and harder for Necros to be seen as useful to a group. When most mobs in GoD *need* to die in 30 seconds else you're up a river without a paddle.. what are we going to do? Sic our pet on it, and lifetap twice? We can't mez anymore, we can't slow or charm because there's no undead, and we can't even do our massive damage via dots if the mob doesn't last more than a minute.

One of the *only* real reasons why a Nec gets invited into trial groups in GoD is because they're so sickeningly hard, and your party stands to lose completely if the cleric dies. So they bring along a Nec as backup.

Bear in mind that an EE costs about 300pp on my server. Most people when they ask me for a res, give me 50p or 100p, and think that covers it. NOT. If you want to donate for a Nec res, 400pp might cover it and give me some plat for my trouble. Not that I've *ever* received 400pp for a res, more often I have to pay out of pocket for it, but no I'm not bitter... Nec rez is already severely limited by cost, so if you don't make the cost of an all/all potion be a LOT more than 300pp, I'm thinking 3-5K might be okay if it's a lesser res, here...That would make it so any random Joe can't just go to the Bazaar, chunk down the pp he can make in a day easy, and all the sudden becomes a nec replacement... then you're taking away one of the only reasons for a Nec to get a group period in the end game. We aren't seen as DPS (mostly cause dot damage isn't reported to other players. But I've seen parses of high end necs doing 400+ DPS without even having all the foci. Then again, this is on long fights, too, using all our AA skills and letting all dots run to duration.) We aren't seen as crowd control anymore, with no upgrades to screaming terror, and no more undead zones. We are, however, seen as a safety net with a pet...

If anyone can rez... fek, I'd become a severely gimped Mage with half the nuking capability and half the pet to most groups. And that's really sad, especially on the trials where a res potion would come in most handily.

[Lickity]

/shrug

You are preaching to shaman, who have zero utility in GoD. The only reason to get a shaman for GoD is all the enchanters and beastlords have logged, and then most groups will just find somewhere else to go.

[Madriu]

Excuse me? Find somewhere else to go? I think you're debasing your class too much.

You can still slow.

Groups could care less whether or not that slow is mitigated, or if it doesn't land until the end of the fight, as long as they've got a slower, it's peachy.

Enchanters are in the GOLD in those trials, not due to slowing ability, but because they can charm a pet that can solo the whole zone for them. And these trials are about massive DPS and killing things fast so they can't do their own massive DPS back on you. So a chanter brings the DPS and the slows. They have too much use, in my opinion... bring too much to the table to the point where if a group doesn't have a chanter, they can forget the trial...

Beastlords though? I wouldn't turn down a Shaman for a Beastlord, really. Shaman have the HP buff that saves your life on those 5 hour long trial runs when all the buffs are gone by the time you get to the boss. Plus, they can be a backup healer in a pinch, as you really need more than 1 heal class in a trial to keep a tank up.

But like I said... a trial is based on massive DPS. If you have the choice between a res-potioned rogue, and a necro for your 1 or 2 dps spots... who you going to choose? Right now, there's a tradeoff, in that that nec can save your butt at the cost of the loss of total DPS. If the group wipes several times, it still can cost thousands of plat to accomplish this. With potions.... no tradeoff whatsoever, unless it's thoroughly expensive to use.

And I really fail to see how giving Shamans the ability to make res potions will allow them to be more accepted in groups. If they're sellable, then people can just buy the res potion, and not need the shaman.

A good idea, might be to make the potions no-drop, thus REQUIRING the shaman to actually be there to complete the res process, thus securing more groups, and adding some more utility to the class. I wouldn't be against that, but just giving the ability to res to everybody, with a tradeable potion that can be stocked up easily... No... just no.

[Lickity]

Making the potions shaman only usable was my original idea that I posted. And as far as my debasing my class, you may be right, but being that everything in GoD mitigates slow, a group is foolish to have a shaman. I get my GoD flags by creating the groups, but you can be guaranteed that you were not the first nor the second person selected for your Gates group if you are a shaman with an invite. The biggest hurt to your ego is when they have an enchanter charming in Tipt and they invite a mage over you so that they can malosinia the pet, while providing DPS. Even after the charm "nerf," enchanters are still the chosen ones, but I'm much more content playing backseat to a full-caster enchanter than a hybird of OUR class beastlord.

However, back on topic. Making the potions NO DROP solves most of the problems with them. Not anyone can be a "pocket-COTH" bot, only a shaman/necro, or clicky-stick rogue. It enables us to be brought along on a dangerous group for when/if the cleric dies, and not have to start over afterward. I'm all for the rez potion idea, but if they are droppable, they will be too expensive for the non-rich shaman. I can afford to make them, but the 95% of the other shaman who are in need of a fix as well might not be able to without sacrificing gear upgrades as well. Alchemy is a skill FOR shaman, not for us to be used by. None of our other potions eliminate the need for us in a group, nor hurt our utility at all. Making shaman make "rez in a bottle" will cement our place as a non-grouping bot, we all already used as buff bots (remember those uber HP buffs you get in the GoD trials, many groups nowadays have a "pocket shaman " for that,) Don't make us potion bots as well.

Beastlords though? I wouldn't turn down a Shaman for a Beastlord, really. Shaman have the HP buff that saves your life on those 5 hour long trial runs when all the buffs are gone by the time you get to the boss. Plus, they can be a backup healer in a pinch, as you really need more than 1 heal class in a trial to keep a tank up.

If you are taking 5 hours to do any of these trials, you are doing something incredibly long. The longest of the trials, arguably trial 4, should take no longer than 2 hours, and iirc, the trials have a 4 hour maximum timer in the sewers. As far as needed a second healer, a good cleric, or a mediocre cleric for that matter, can keep up any tank capable of taking the bosses in these trials. A shaman as a backup healer is a joke, we can't heal a single round of damage on the trash in Tipt/Vxed, let alone the bosses in any trial. If the cleric goes down, you are toast one way or the other, you are better off with a second tank than a second healer in Gates

[Lothay]

Shaman class issues, while interesting and passionately felt, really aren't appropriate to this particular discussion.

Let's not debate class utility, class balance, etc. outside the realm of the alchemy tradeskill, shall we? Those issues belong on a class site or on SoE's boards.

Thank you,

[Abazagaroth]

So if you have rez potions that can be used on anyone by anyone, what is to stop a rogue from keeping the key in tipt on a corpse in barindu, looting it before heading in with a group, having the group die, and drag them all the way to the riddler wall before rezzing?