Oh come on.... Are you for REAL?

[Nhin Impious]

I for one wouldn't care about a calendar depicting 12 highly attractive scantily clad female EQ characters-- IF they were actually doing something, not just "looking cute"-- and, of course, by my standards of "highly attractive," meaning that women who fight with melee weapons need the muscles to use those weapons. Just as in society today, wearing highly fragile clothes that are difficult to move freely in is a sign that you don't have to work in those clothes, I'm sure that in EQ society, wearing a flimsy little caster robe is a sign that you can throw Ice Comets like nobody's business and don't have to CARE about getting up-close and personal with the mobs.

And no, the "Babes of Norrath" calendar will not be purchased or displayed at my house; we're currently trying to teach a Very Important Lesson to the young rogue here. She's an adorable little girl who is very aware of it, and is having to learn that being adorable alone isn't enough, she needs to be friendly, kind, honest, and helpful to make friends. I wouldn't mind her seeing pictures of some fine-looking lady mages siccing their earth pets on something-- or even a rogue dressed in tight leather pants and skimpy top, twisted around picking a lock to get herself out of some trouble-- because I don't think beautiful women are bad role models if they are doing something interesting as well.

As for "getting your jollies by looking at cartoons"-- I happen to think High Elf females in leather armor are pretty nice to look at, personally (we won't even cover me and Barbarian men...mmm) and I don't see any difference between finding Cleric Qali attractive, and Hot_Model_X in Men's Magazine attractive-- sure, Hot_Model_X is a real woman, but you have exactly as much chance of meeting and dating one as the other. (On the other hand, you might use the roleplaying moment to toss a compliment or two, hit it off, and meet the person behind the toon-- and who knows, he or she might not be so bad...)

Nhinx Aphsion, cleric of Innoruuk, played by someone who looks nothing like her

[Angelsyn]

There's only one thing about this that offends me...

The artwork is second-rate.

There are so many better artists out there. By the sample art and other stuff I've seen, this calander is junk.

[Aandaie]

Yeah, agreed with Angel.

The pictures they show are really not that great. They remind me of the poor sites which say they re EQ art sites and more or less dress up poser 3d models like Everquest females.

SOE really does the "sell with chests" thing a lot lately. Most hilarious is the new EQOA cd, "Frontiers." I guess it is referring to the cleavage frontier it so prominently displays.

http://everquestonlineadventures.sta...Characters.jpg

[Itzena]

Originally posted by Itek
[BWere the "offended" also offended by the costuming in children's afternoon comics? Sailor Moon, Pokemon, Yu-Gi-Oh, etc etc etc. [/B]

I'm more offended at the lumping in of Sailor Moon with Pokemon and YiGiOh. {Insert rant about stupid SM hack-job dub monstrousity here}

Besides, complaing about exploitation of the female form in EQ is a little late, IMO. Like, five years or so - go look at 'naked' female wood elves or dark elves or pretty much every other female race bar ogres/trolls (for obvious reasons) and erudites (because 'naked' female erudite wear was actually clothes rather than underwear).

Random aside: The original EQ art director, back in the 989 Studios/Verant days, was female.

[Cigarskunk]

Originally posted by Cubwynn

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Dunthor Warsmith
The majority finding it acceptable doesn't make it any less offensive to the offended minority.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Boy, if more people thought like that, life would be a lot easier...

Sadly, too many people DO think like that - it's called political correctness.

OK, so let's take the tyrany of the minority and impose thier will upon the majority for a moment -

1) No more Christmas since it offends athiest and non-christians
2) No more booze because it offends non-drinkers
3) No more meat because it offends veggans
4) No more leather/fur goods because it offends animal lovers
5) No more cheesecake because it offends feminist
6) No more EQ because it offends bible thumpers (it and D&D are satanic)
7) No more tradeskills because they offend PLers
8) No more leveling because it offends tradeskillers
9) No more violence in game because it offends pacifists
10) No more nothing because somewhere there is a minority that is offended by this harmless form of entertainment of the majority

It's very simple - if something offends you, then don't buy it, don't watch it, don't listen to it, don't read it, don't play it, don't expose yourself to it - is that too complicated?

I like Pepe Le Pew merchandise - should I decide to try to ban non-Pepe Le Pew merchandise in the stores? No - I simply don't buy the Tweety Bird merchandise and I make requests to the managers and in writing to the companies to get Pepe Le Pew stuff in.

So Sony puts out a cheesecake calander - no one is forcing you to buy it so don't force other people not to buy it - if someone wants to get it, then let them. How the heck is this calander SOOO harmful to you that you feel the need to smite it from existance?

People are WAY too hypersensative now adays and the worst part about it is that they only let themselves get upset about petty little things like a stinking calander of some scantily clad digital tarts. For the love of god, there are real women and real girls being terribly abused and exploited all over the world - literally being used as slaves and forced to do terrible things - things far worse then posing in chainmail for a freakin calander.

So why don't you take that rightous indignation and instead of wasting it defending the dignity of so fake women posing in a PG rated (at worse) calander, direct all that compasion towards those RL women that are being forced to suffer indignanties and deprevations the likes of which most of you can't even imagine.

[Grimina]

First: Recognize that this post is full of opinions given in response to a request for opinions on the calendar. This does not mean that no one cares about other world/life events or that they feel this one holds more priority, it just means this post is where opinions about the calendar can be discussed. We have room in our brains for more than one topic at a time. I personally am concerned about the situation in Afghanistan, the whole Michael Jackson thing, and whether or not I'll get to see Return of the King this week (not necessarily in that order)...and chewing gum all at the same time. Go me.

Next: Recognize that because we say we don't like the calendar doesn't mean we intend to write to our local congressman detailing why it should be banned. It simply means we don't intend to buy it. Our dislike will in no way cause others to lose out on the opportunity to buy it (unless the majority feels the same and SoE decides to pull it...in which case putting it out at all would be forcing the will of the minority on the majority). Because someone feels offended by it, doesn't mean they are telling you that you have to be offended. Being offended is a gut reaction, you can't tell someone to be or not be offended. Tell them you don't feel the same, and your reasons why --without going for personal attacks. If you want them to respect your opinion you must respect theirs. Otherwise why talk about it at all if you don't care to hear the response? (that is not targeted at any one person, but rather to all sides)

Finally: If you don't like someone having a differing opinion on this subject, ignore it...don't read it...walk away. It's not worth the heartburn. (that of course goes for both sides of the issue as well)

[Cigarskunk]

Ah, don't mind me - my rant was more directed at the comments by Cubwynn and Dunthor - it was the mentality which they espoused that set me off. Hearing and reading nothing but news stories these past two weeks about different towns, schools or freelance yahoos attacking the holidaze has totally turned me against the offended minority - whether it was 3rd graders being prevented from handing out candy canes or folks rewriting holiday songs to remove the religious elements it was the same attitude - the bulk of the people had to subjigate thier good times in order that some chucklehead wasn't reminded that he's too intollerant to let others be.

Sigh - why can't the folks who are always asking the question "why can't we all just get along" realise that they're the ones refusing to get along?

[Shingen Takeshi]

Firstly, my opinion on the whole matter is - yes, they are catering to teenage boys.

Sadly, "Guy Gamers" rule the market as far as targets go. The "Girl Gamer" segment has not yet been realised by most game companies' Marketing department.

Originally posted by Cigarskunk
I simply don't buy the Tweety Bird merchandise

Oh, and for the record - Tweety Bird is TEH EVIL.

[kiztent]

I'm just going to reflect on the not inconsiderable irony here and move on snickering.

[Dunthor Warsmith]

Originally posted by CigarSkunk
Sadly, too many people DO think like that - it's called political correctness.

OK, so let's take the tyrany of the minority and impose thier will upon the majority for a moment

My opinions and stances my very well be unique to me, making them thus in a very small minority. I don't expect the world to be molded around my opinions - it would be grossly unfair to the other 6 billion people. Fufilling every whim of the minority at the cost of the majority is an unfair plan of action, just as the majority ignoring the minority(s) is (although you can argue about differences magnitudes, it still is unfair in either case). That does not mean the minority should not be considered when deciding how to proceed. It should be a question of balance, between all the stances involved. And both sides, even the smallest of minorities, still have the right to have their own opinions and reactions to topics, and to peacibly express them. Proceeding in any given direction does not necessarily change the opinions and reactions of people, for or against it.

So while it may be a good marketing strategy and socially acceptable to make things like this calender, some people will still be opposed to it, the aspects of society it represents or derives from, or the ideology behind it, and they still have every right to those feelings and the ability to express them, even if that expression does little or nothing to change the item in question.

I'm personally not fond of the concept of the calendar, and am rather repulsed and disguisted by the aspect of our society from which it ultimately derives. Those are my opinions, and it has been proven many times my own sense of morals is rather non-standard, so I don't really expect many, if any, to agree with me. I wouldn't be surprised if more things like this came out under the Everquest brand, but I would be dissappointed in SOE and have continually decreasing respect for them in a way no hoard of bugs or balance changes ever could do. But that's just me.

[Cigarskunk]

Originally posted by Dunthor Warsmith
And both sides, even the smallest of minorities, still have the right to have their own opinions and reactions to topics, and to peacibly express them.

That's not the problem though - the problem is when the minority presents it's opinion and refuses to accept the majorities' right to continue to do it's thing anyway due to having not been swayed by what the minority has to say.

[Dunthor Warsmith]

Originally posted by Cigarskunk
That's not the problem though - the problem is when the minority presents it's opinion and refuses to accept the majorities' right to continue to do it's thing anyway due to having not been swayed by what the minority has to say.

I will agree to that. It's an issue that comes up far too often, and can result in some significant problems.

[Shinianad]

Originally posted by Itzena
I'm more offended at the lumping in of Sailor Moon with Pokemon and YiGiOh. {Insert rant about stupid SM hack-job dub monstrousity here}

Besides, complaing about exploitation of the female form in EQ is a little late, IMO. Like, five years or so - go look at 'naked' female wood elves or dark elves or pretty much every other female race bar ogres/trolls (for obvious reasons) and erudites (because 'naked' female erudite wear was actually clothes rather than underwear).

Random aside: The original EQ art director, back in the 989 Studios/Verant days, was female.

Erudite Females have real clothes? That nightie is real clothes?

Humans and Halflings, maybe Gnomes from what I remember are fully clothed at start. High elves are skimpily clothed but less so that Erudites.

Ogres and trolls are under clothed as well. Anything short of full body armour is under clothed for them

[eniamn]

sailor moon has all short skirted girls who lose their clothes when getting into the superhero "uniform". yu gi oh has a kid who gains a couple inches and hair and eye adjustment when being possesed and most characters were pants. pokemon. well the girl in advanced were's pants and i beleive misty did as well. though i had expected something between her and ash because if he started at 12 (school huh?) and its been on at least 4 years then he's 16.

[Annalina Romanov]

I'm a convention director for an Anime convention, so I deal with a lot of "cheesecake", a.k.a. fanservice (I happen to be the Art Show director). The calender doesn't faze me much, though I do wonder who drew the images . . . I've seen far better, to be quite honest.

The big breasts get kinda old after a while, and I do wonder if people realize that at some point, big breasts actually look kinda ugly?

It would be nice to see some fanservice directed at women at some point. Unlike anime, I have yet to see any equivalent in the west.

-Annalina