Questions on Shadowscream

[Lindera]

Ok have a few questions...

First, is there a difference in the number of skillups I will get if I make SS Boots as opposed to Guants, until they are trivial? Well...other than my success rate?

Second, does strength affect your skill-up chance or just your success rate? I currently have 254wis with KEI.

Third, what is the *average* amount of combines per skillup in the 200s. After reading several posts about skillup data, it seems to be around 30. Is that an accurate observation?

Thanks in advance!

[Kradlum]

This is all anecdotal, from my own experience:

I found I got a better skill up rate when trying combines about 30 points above my skill.

Strength doesn't effect your success rate at all. Only your smithing skill (+ modifier if you have one) effects your success rate. Strength will effect your skill up rate only if it is above your WIS and/or INT. i.e. For smithing, the highest of WIS, INT and STR effects your skill up rate.

There doesn't seem to be an average. It varies so widely between person to person, and from point to point, it's hard to pin the number down. Personally from 188-200 I got 1 skill up in 8 tries. 200-201 took 1 try. Then it slowed down to 1 in 13 upto about 210. Then I gave up counting.

[Lindera]

Ok if strength doesnt help your skill-ups or your success rate, why do I see a lot of folks trying to max out both stats? (Assuming they have INT or WIS as a primary stat...)

I'm not saying you're incorrect just trying to figure out if there's a huge misconception going around or something to that effect.

And the reason why I ask about the average number of combines is because I am hitting right about 90 attempts so far at 192.

[frynque]

misread

you misread him.

if you're strength is HIGHER than int/wis, it gets used as the primary stat for adjusting skill bumps. which makes sense for many non-int/wis based classes (warriors, paladins, bards, etc.) and for classes that can uber-buff their strength (shamans, bards, beastlords, etc.).

on average you will see 10-60 combines per skill up from 188-220, depending on the item you're smithing. i find some items have "better skill increase chances" than others. shadowscream is by far the cheapest in raw plat cost per combine, but has THE WORST skill rate of any options, i've come to see. YMMV and you have to weigh cost of materials versus time spent farming versus resale factors. there are some good options for skilling if you're not in a hurry (willing to accept a skill bump or two every week) and want to spend your time hunting for xp, rather than farming greens.

frynque trolkins
troll smith of Xev

[Lindera]

You're saying the same thing I am, that STR only matters if it's higher than WIS or INT. So I am wondering why people are going to a lot of trouble to raise their STR when their INT or WIS is already 250+.

Shadowscream is my only option, I have about 4k to my name, which I am saving for a PoTC kit to get the Solstice Earring.

[Velurian]

You're saying the same thing I am, that STR only matters if it's higher than WIS or INT. So I am wondering why people are going to a lot of trouble to raise their STR when their INT or WIS is already 250+.

Superstition. Or not trusting SOE to have told the whole truth about the way things work.

[frynque]

duh

not every smith is a cleric/druid/mage/wizard/ench/necro with 255 int/wis. additionally, self buffing to 265 str is hella cheaper than buying int/wis gear (my hunting wis is 220. i could buy more wis gear, but i can self buff str to 265 for free; guess which option wins)

take off the myopic blinders.

frynque trolkins
troll smith of xev

[Thicket Tundrabog]

There are two semi-controversial issues related to skill-ups and success rates. There are many threads on these boards related to the two issues.

1. A few people believe that there is a secondary effect from strength or dexterity that improves skill-ups beyond your primary stat (usually the higher of intelligence/wisdom). For example, as a wood-elf tailor I had 255 wisdom for skillups. Some people were convinced that also raising dexterity as high as possible, preferably to 255, would improve skillups. The majority opinion, which I agree with, says there is only one skill-up determining stat. In my opinion, the two-stat skillup effect is an EQ myth that just won't die.

2. Many people believe that skillups are higher for successful combines than for failures. As a result, these folks do everything possible to increase combine success. This includes using Geerloks or other tradeskill enhancing item. It also includes doing combines with trivial levels close to their current skill level. I personally agree with this, although a significant number of tradeskillers don't.

Finally, it's pretty universally accepted that success rates are solely dependant on your skill (including the enhancing effect of Geerlok and similar devices).

Thicket

[Lindera]

Frynque...

There's no problem with Myopic Blinders, you seem to be the only one misunderstanding me. I asked why people are boosting strength, when they ALREADY have WIS or INT as their PRIMARY stat.

I'm fully aware of how easy it is to max out strength compared to Wis or Int, and I don't need the lesson from you.

Please read smeone's post thoroughly, then re-read it again, before getting snotty.

Velurian and Thicket...

Thanks for the answer. I did some searching and didn't find anything right off the bat, about data regarding having multiple stats affect skill-ups. So I'll just worry about getting my KEI then before I go do combines.

[ChaseFV]

Just for clarification

The definitive word on this matter.

Please note that all visitors are heartily encouraged to read the FAQ forum before coming to the skill-specific forums.

Cheers,
C

[Kcalehc]

um, don't know if anyone noticed but alot of ore is HEAVY. so having 255+ int isnt going to help you walk from the vendor to the forge with 30 blocks of ore is it? Thats at least one rationale that seems to have been missed completely...

[Lindera]

Ya know, back when I started reading this forum, flaming was extremely uncommon. Now it seems that every single post includes a post from flamer_001 saying "OMFG can't you read the FAQ, n00b?"

The FAQ states that wis, int, or str -whichever is higher- will determine rate of skillup. I had noticed that a LOT of people posted their str as well as their wis or int. My question regarding str was whether there was new info or data that supported a second stat helping skillups, or if it was just superstition. THAT was not answered in the holiest of holies FAQ. TYVM.

My question was answered, but it seems that people just cant stop posting holier-than-thou RTFM posts. Great job running off yet another member of the tradeskill community.

:roll:

[Kradlum]

I posted a reply earlier, then deleted it thinking it was harsh, but now I wish I had left it here.

It does state quite clearly in the FAQ that the highest of WIS/INT/STR is what is used. There is no ambiguity there. I also stated this quite clearly.

Your attitude on this thread has been appalling. Flaming is extremely uncommon, it tends to happen only when rude, ignorant and unappreciative people come here. There's only one person in this thread who fits that description. I for one won't be answering any of your questions again.

[Lothay]

This thread has degenerated.

The question has been asked and answered.

Locked.

~Lothay