Keeping Costs Under Control While Raising Skill...

[FeroceFV]

Hey all, first post here. I'm a character learning the craft as I level. I'm a human bard, and while my strength stinks, I can usually snooker a local shaman into helping me out there.

I recently got to 76 skill in smithing, and am starting Banded Armor. I am a true untwinked newbie on Firiona Vie, and the 1pp per sheet cost associated with Banded armor production is a bit steep for me. I have thus far saved up a stack of metal sheets by converting rusted weapons like mad, and my guild helps me somewhat with that (we are a new all-bard guild on FV made up of veterans from other servers).

Smithing is keeping me pretty broke. That is fine by me; My gear is good enough, and bards don't really need good gear till later on in life when dungeon crawling becomes necessary. By smithing, I can keep my AC high enough for practical purposes.

My question is, how can I keep the costs down enough for me to get to the profitable stages of smithing?

I know I can keep going after rusted weapon conversions to get cheaper metal sheets. After that, things get a bit hairier. The embroidery needle is an option, and once I get high enough, I could certainly carry some celestial solvents and make the essences as I go. While cheaper, this would take up a lot of time; perhaps I should make banded as much as I possibly can before I use this recipe?

So once I hit 122, what lower-cost options do I have?

At present, the only decent option I see is the seafarers' buckler. One HQ sheet of metal, one mold, and one water is all that is consumed. By farming fine steel weapons, the cost of the HQ ore can be heavily reduced. Of course, I'll need a good source close to a bank I can use; perhaps the lizard-men outside of CT, then to Oggok? Anyone know an easier way to farm Fine Steel? The buckler trivials at 188. This phase will be trickier, since my guild friends will want to sell the fine steel they get, rather than turn it in for armor like they are doing with the banded right now.

After 188, what's the most cost-effective way for a human to raise skill? I'm not going to have thousands of plat to constantly blow on this, so I'm looking at doing Full Plate or Field Plate, but I wonder how hard/pricey it will be to get the tempers. Acrylia seems like a good option, but it is heavily dependent upon dropped ore. Still, I suppose I can make my level raising at the Sambata Caves for a while.

[Kradlum]

This thread might help: http://mboards.eqtraders.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=5000

[Hateborn]

Cheap Smithing

As a race that is able to shop in freeport you can reach 115 smithing for free or in profit simply by selling to NPC merchants. (I have had a report that they have nerfed the price of small bricks of ore in the following steps, so check that carefully).

In EFP there are two merchants / merchant groups that sell rusty weapons - Hallards (resales?) and one of the newbie quest merchants in the 'tunnel / warren' area of EFP just outside the Dismal Rage guild entrance. These merchants have unlimited supplies of rusty weapons.

I use the latter merchant as there is a forge very close to him.

Go fill a couple of backpacks with water (nearest is the Inn by the Soulbinder) and sharpening stones (north Freeport sadly) - then buy as many Rusty Broadswords as you can carry and still stagger the few feet to the forge. They cost around 6sp (best priced rusty to ore ratio, trust me)

Sharpen them and convert to ore (small brick), then stagger back and sell the ore (used to sell for 4gold per brick, giving a straight out 3gp profit per brick - this price may well have been nerfed) or combine into large bricks and then forge into sheets of metal. (Sheet metal price hasnt been nerfed - so you can sell at this stage for profit).

Use this method until your fingers are sore or you have enough sheet metal. Then head round the corner to the banded mold vendors and start making banded. As the sheet metal was basically free when you sell the output from your banded making to the vendors you will make a tidy profit as you skill up (alternatively save some for sale in the bazaar).

And there you are - a master smith at no cost at all. (I sold some bricks / sheets to finance the water and cost of molds. In all I collected 10gp off mobs before starting smithing - by the time I was a master smith I had 400pp banked).

~~~

Since then I have moved on to ornate chain which I am financing by hunting for fine steel and ore in Sol A.

Once again as the metal is basically free when I purchase the chainmail patterns and precious metal bars I can make the armour and sell back to NPC vendors - I break even on silver, electrum and gold but would lose money on platinum. So I am moving to human cultural for further skill ups. (Currently skill 147) (Human cultural looks highly profitable - my first combines were 3 collars - mold 22pp, metal and temper free - succeeded on two of three. Outlay 66pp, price from vendor 82pp per collar).

(Obviously it helps that I have a group that is willing to hunt in sol a and OOT where we can get great xp and collect smithing components).

[Zeralenn]

As I said in a previous post, farming and converting fine steel to HQ ore is false economy. Better to sell the fine steel and use the proceeds to buy HQ ore from vendors. You'll be time and money ahead.

The bottleneck point for acrylia armor is NOT acrylia; it's windstones for the combine acrylia temper. These are rare drops and you need 2 for every temper. It's hard enough to get windstones that very few smiths recommend it as a skilling path.

Your cheapest (but by far most time intensive) post 188 skilling path is shadowscream armor. You will see many, many, MANY threads about the "joys" of shadowscream and other skilling paths:

http://mboards.eqtraders.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3735

http://mboards.eqtraders.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4837

http://mboards.eqtraders.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4722

http://mboards.eqtraders.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4571

http://mboards.eqtraders.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3869

But, FOR GOD'S SAKE, do fine plate til 188. Shadowscream, though cheap, is a very, very hard way to skill up.

...Zera

[FeroceFV]

Is fine plate cheaper to make than the Seafarer's Buckler? All that is needed for that is two small HQ ore bricks, the water, and the mold, and the trivial is at 188.

How much do small bricks of HQ ore cost?

[scarbrowed]

IF you do the needles, make sure to check this thread to make money from them: http://mboards.eqtraders.com/phpBB2/...pic.php?t=4864

[Malathos]

The other trick is to buy up any rusty two handed swords you see.
These normally sell for around 3 and a half gp. Use a sharpening stone to convert it into a tarnished 2hs and then combine it with a flask of water to give you a large brick of ore. These you can then sell to the vendors for 1.2pp. The trick is trying to carry 10 two handed swords and still be able to walk.

Butcherblock seems to be a good source of rusty 2hs - always drops from wandering greenblood ogres and people normally let them rot or just sell them to vendors

I'm still surprised this hasn't been nerfed yet - oh and the combining of small bricks of ore up to form a sheet of metal hadn't been changed when I last tried it yesterday So this is another cheap route once you've got your cash.

[Hateborn]

Fine steel conversion

Zera - to be honest I havent actually checked the prices I get for selling FS compared to the buying price for HQ ore, but the impression I had formed was that the balance was well in favour of conversion, certainly at the charisma level available to a human warrior

Maybe it varies according to weapon - after all 3 FS daggers gets almost as much HQ metal as 3 FS two handers, but the sell price is different. I'll look into it. (I think, and this is stretching the memory a bit, that the daggers would sell for around 3pp .. so 9pp for three, but the ore would cost me about 22pp for a lrg brick? I am way too poor to write off 13pp a brick <grin>)

In the meantime I enjoy going about it this way - and the hunting is still profitable and XP worthy in Sol A for most of my group.

[Stilts Stonebender]

I would have to agree that Acrylia isn't really a viable skill up path. The windstones are far too expensive to buy and too rare to farm in any quanity. Acrylia is strictly a money item. You make it for your own use or to sell. BPs and legs seem to sell the best.

Even though I don't make it that often, I convert all blocks and large bricks that I get to folded sheets of Acrylia (stackable). Small pieces and small bricks are turned in to studs (stackable) and/or boning (stackable) for tailors. I normally make a few lg. bricks in to stackable rings (~4) for jointing and keep those in the bank as well.

As a side note, instead of making the jointing beforehand, I leave it in ring form until I'm ready to do the combine. Rings stack, jointing does not. I do the same thing with my brellium rings/jointing, but I usually have near a full stack of them on hand. It's always my final subcombine prior to the final click. Plus, if someone actually wants Acrylia Chain (or Brellium chain) it actually saves you a step.

[dender]

Wek, i may be new to the boards, but i'll tell you what i did to keep the cost of banded down.

Buy small pieces of ore, lots of them, and turn them into bricks. small peice of ore = 1.2 silver.


I haven't tried this on MQ or HQ yet, but know this: you can buy 60 small pieces for about 3.5 platinum, and get 20 small bricks of ore. figure, 18 with a couple of fails. thats 7.2 platinum returned.... just a little food for thought

[FeroceFV]

Hateborn, you are SO right

I have to say, so far, Hateborn takes the cake for cost-effectiveness. Buying broadswords and converting them to sheets and subsequently to banded has allowed me to profit as I skill, by just selling back to the vendors! I'm going to miss this after Banded trivials out.

I think the shortsword is probably the most cost-effective way to get small pieces of ore.

Regarding HQ ore... how much are the MQ and HQ ores for a person with good faction/charisma? I know that fine steel daggers only sell for around 2pp, and they make a small brick of HQ ore... This seems to me to be a good way to get HQ metal sheets.

[xaanru]

if you happen to be levelling somewhere that HQ ore drops, you might want to consider making ornate chain. Using dropped ore, you'll come out decently on costs. HK is decent for HQ ore drops, but only in War and Raider rooms. THis is a nice, fast easy way to skillup, until the cost of bars of gold/plat get to be too much. The silver/electrum will result in a net gain in cash, if you use dropped ore.

[Segal]

Wouldnt it be alot easier just to hunt for cash and buy the stuff you need.

I know that farming greens is not the most enjoyable of activities but it is certainly profitable.

Kill Zomies in Unrest, you can sell the skins. Kill spiders of nearly any variety and get 2 or 3 plat for each. Kill in Droga and get skins and salts, I have seen these sell for 25 pp each. Farm swirling mists in Steamfont, sell easily at 30 pp a pop. Kill Fairies in Lesser Faydark, sell the morning dew for 30 pp a pop. Essence of Moonlight are 25 pp a pop and I farmed 80 in 3 hours last time I was there.

Go to the bazaar and do a search for armor, look for someone that is obviously a smith (perferably of a different race, most smiths don't relish more cultural competition). Ask that person what they need farmed and what type of deal they are willing to give you. I have two young adventurers that farm Swirling Mists and Morning Dew for me, I pay them a premium for the service.

On a mature server, 100-200 plat an hour is easily obtained if you know what and where to hunt regardless of level.

[Grimsoul]

Where did you find the receipe for the seafarers' buckler. I havn't seen that one.

[Balkin]

actually....

There's a prob with the Seafarer's buckler...

This is the recipe.

buckler mold, smithy hammer, flask water, HQ sheet of metal

The problem is, the OLD trivial was 188...

The NEW trivial since the smithing trivial nerf back in May 2002 is <= 107.

This brings up a point I've been considering for some time now. It's been almost a year. Isn't it time to get rid of that section in the smithing lists that shows the OLD trivial? It was a great comparision right after the trivial nerf in May 2002, but now, it's just confusing newer tradeskillers. I think I'll start a post on it in the Denmum's area.