Disappointed with PoP Blacksmithing

[Radric]

Call it a rant if you like, but there isn't much blacksmithing to be done in PoP. Other tradeskillers will likely say similar things, but this is The smithing forum.

I'm sure many have noticed this, but no one seems to be saying anything. It's too **** hard to get the items needed to make any armor!

I'm going to use Nightmare Plate as an example. The Plane of Nightmares is one of, if not the most hunted zones and the PoP expansion has been out for 3 months now. One would think that there would be an abundance of Nightmare armor made and selling in the bazaar. This of course is not the case. The rarity and number of items needed to make a single piece of this mediocre armor, makes blacksmithing impossible or at the very least impractical. To make a single Nightmare Plate BP, you will need: 6 midnight stone, 7 nightmare mephit blood, 6 fetid slime, and 7 nightmare iron. There is also several hundred pp in easily purchasable items. This again is just to smith one BP, assuming no failures. A BP that is inferior to all cultural armor I can readily think of. Some of these items are easier than others to obtain. But to obtain ALL of them, for ONE ATTEMPT at a piece of armor is not right. I'm talking about the Plane of Nightmares here. A zone that ranges from 50-100 at all times of the day. You can imagine how obtaining the items needed for blacksmithing in higher level/less populated zones can be.

The biggest problem, besides the rarity of these items, is that multiple tradeskills use the same item. Off the top of my head, Mephit Blood is used for blacksmithing, tailoring, pottery, and jewelcraft and an enchanter is going to need one to even obtain the imbuing spell!

I just want to blacksmith. It doesn't have to compare to uber drop armor, but I'll like to, at least, get my hands on the items needed to practice my skill. I'm not sure why I even posted this. I guess it was to vent my frustration or hope to inspire some future change. Feel free to offer your opinions.

[Zopharr]

PoP Armors have their Place

I disagree with your take on PoP armors. While the Tier 1 plate armor isn't anything to write home about, the Night Terror Chain is pretty nice for chain classes. The 8 May recipes seemed pretty weak for chain-wearing folk, especially compared to the quality of the BD plate; the new chain recipes close that gap.

As for materials, I think it depends on your servers economy. I've gotten three friends outfitted with close to complete sets of the Night Terror Chain (those few slots not filled they already had something better), and sold over half a dozen tunics and legs. I have enough materials to make another half dozen tunics. All materials have been bought (most in bazaar) except for 31 Fetid Slime my friends and I farmed over 2 hours one night and a few stones/bricks of nightmare iron they have gotten for me in exp groups. I also have passed on a lot of midnight stones that I thouight were overpriced. I know Sinuuyanea has also made a fair bit of the chain on my server, again using primarily purchased materials. So the stuff drops in substantial quantities, it just may not be making it to market on your server.

While it would have been nice for the Tier 1 armors to have been an upgrade from the BD cultural, I'm not disappointed given the quality of the existing plate armors. The way I see it, the cultural armors and the night terror chain provide players who can wear them an alternative to the Skyshrine/Kael quest armor timesinks. It may not be better, but it is close enough that it is a viable option. I know Garshok doesn't plan on setting foot in ToV.

And besides - having put up with a lot of "grape" jokes when Zopharr was running around in his hate armor, it is kind of fun to be putting people in purple armor. <grin>

So I'm pretty happy with the tier 1 PoP amithed armor.

[Sinuuyanea Nocturne]

Better than the brown stuff you used to wear, eh Zopharr? <img src="http://www.boomspeed.com/sinuuyanea/dcrazz.gif" alt="Poppy-pants!">

Nightmare smithing isnt necessarily difficult; the blood is only used for smithing and the imbues, the slime often finds it's way on vendors, and I have no trouble buying/farming a stack or so of Midnight Stones in a couple days. What I do want to see change is the number of tempers needed for the plate; 5.5 tempers for a Breastplate or Greaves is a pain, compared to 3 for a chain tunic that I cant hope to keep in stock...

Sleepy...<img src="http://www.boomspeed.com/sinuuyanea/dcsleep.gif" alt="...zzz...failed a metal bit...grrr...snore...">

Addenum: You dont have to be an enchanter to imbue nightmares, and my Cleric jeweller friend, at 250 raw skill with Geerlok, has yet to fail an emblem for me out of the stack or so she's made for me...

[Elmarr Armoursmythe]

Nightmare Chain Market

What price is Nightmare Mephit Blood generally sold for on your server? And what price do you charge for Nightmare Chain Tunics or Legs?

I did a bit of comparison yesterday to see if there might be a decent market for the chain on my server (never seen any of it for sale) and it does look like it might be a very good market for the tunics and greaves for Shammies, Rangers and Rogues, for the right price. However the blood seems to be as scarce as hen's teeth. I managed to get 4 for 2500 pp each and felt that was a great deal (in addition to 8 Nightmare Rings for 2000 each from the same vendor - which was really odd since the blood is needed to make the temper to make the rings - /shrug). Before this purchase, I had only seen 1 or 2 NIghtmare Mephit Blood for sale for around 5K pp each, so it was not worth buying to make the items. At the reduced (2500 pp price for blood)

Assuming a 50% success rate, this means cost to make for a tunic will be:

[3 x 2500 (for rings at 2500 pp per blood) + 1 x 2500 (for emblem) + 500 (for sundries, essence, iron etc.)] x 2 (to account for failures) = 21K

That means fopr a decent profit, I'd have to sell these for 2x cost to make or about 42K. Does that make sense? I don't think the market will bear this price. What do you all think?
Regards,

[globeadue]

i just saw these on xegony bazaar, and looked up additional pieces, and drooled my rangers brains out!! pp wise i cant afford em *cry* but fyi of the 4 pieces for sale, 2x bp's one at 50k, one at 35k, legs for 40k legs 24k boots.
by all means dont be takeing these for etched in stone prices 8)
good luck in your combines

[Zopharr]

Night Terror Chain

Elmarr,

Prices for materials have varied over time. The Nightmare Mephit Blood was originally 500pp each, but after a week or two began a slow decline and for the last few weeks has generally been available at 150pp each, occasionally 100pp. Fetid Slime goes through cycles where it may not be available for a week or so at a time, and then there are a few stacks selling at 100pp each. Nightmare Iron i can usually find on vendors.

The bottleneck on Quellious has been the midnight stones, available for anywhere from 500pp to 2k - trending towards 1.5-2k for the last few weeks, with few coming on the market for the last two weeks - less people hunting there as they get flagged for PoV.

As for what I charge, I generally charge based on prices of comparable dropped items. (Smithed BD legs, for example, I sell at the same cost as Blood Runed Legs, BPs for a cost similar to Deepwater or Blood Ember). I was selling Night Terror Tunics for 24k each for awhile, and legs for 22k, and for awhile was selling one piece a night off my bazaar mule.

Now that the chain market has become saturated and demand is lessening (and I've met my short term goal of getting several friends outfitted in Night Terror Chain), I've dropped the prices to 15-18k for Tuncs and similar costs for leggings. I could drop it more and sell a lot faster, but I am satisfied with the current pace.

[Sinuuyanea Nocturne]

The people in the Quellious bazaar are out of their frickin minds: 1500pp+ for a Midnight Stone? Not from this Necromancer! <img src="http://www.boomspeed.com/sinuuyanea/dcrazz.gif" alt="Pirates, all of ya!">

I can get them by word of mouth for 500pp apice...usually can score 10-20 in a day.

[wold2]

On Drinal the blood and slime are never for sale in bazaar. I've made 2 of the Night terror chain tunics. The chain is nice stuff, but its been hard on my server to get the components.
I'm a little disappointed with how hard it is to smith in pop, not to mention the tier two and tier three armor and beyond...

[Niall]

I am disappointed in PoP smithing for one reason - its all very high skill.

Smithing is becoming ridiculous (as are most other tradeskills)- with nearly all worthwile items loaded into the high 200s trivial range. Wasn't the whole reason that FS plate was "nerfed" to a lower trivial to even out the progression? Why then has nearly everything since then been 220+ trivial?

I'd love to see a LOT more stuff like the plain Acrylia armors/weapons added into the game - there is no reason they couldn't have made some more "mid-range" items with PoP rather than loading it all into the 250+ skill range.

[windeliane]

On Terris, PoP Smithing components are almost never sold in bazaar. As soon as i see some, i buy at any price below 1k.

So far i have sold approx 4 Terror BP (30k), 4 Terror legs (25k then 20k).

Atm i m looking for a last drop of pure rain to attempt my hurricane plate BP for fun, i wanna see the color

[wyrmbane_]

It all depends on your level

Using Night Terror, since it is the most available PoP smithing. Hurricane, which is the next evolution requires Tier III Access, which most people may not have.

Components needed:
Mephit Blood
Nightmare Iron
Fetid Slime
Midnight Stones
raw Diamonds

Skill Needed:
201+ Jeweler
201+ smith
150+ Brewing

People Required
Enchanter for Imbued Nightmare
Enchanter for Distilled Mana

If you are level 51+, some of these are easy to get. If you are level 55+ with friend, all of them are not bad. Lets go through the list.

Mephit Blood - You MUST go into the Hobgoblin Caves. No other way to get it other than to buy it. Prices vary. Mobs in the caves are 57-60. Tough, Hard hitting. But, it is great XP through level 65. It is fun, you can get other items you can sell, learn good group tactics, and have a shot at Ethereal and Spectral Parchments. All of my Parchments have come from here. Expect a 20-30% drop rate of blood. Yes, you need a lot, but you also will get good xp with your friends.

Nightmare Iron - You will collect more than enough of this while getting the mephits. Good Xp for you.

Fetid Slime - The Slaugilugs are rarily camped. Enough to keep a low 50's group occupied for a long time. Easy to get to. Safe to hunt. They are druids, but single Pullable with Pacify / harmony of Nature. Decent XP 55 and lower, ok xp at higher levels. Drop rate is not perfect, but there are a couple drops that are good to sell, but rare.

Midnight Stones - These are my Personal Nemesis. Prices vary, but are also a pain to get. You will likely end up buying them.

raw Diamonds - you will get these while hunting the hobgoblins and be able to get a decent amount while getting blood / Iron.


In short. if you go to Nightmare for XP, and collect the components with friends, you will get all you need to make the armor, and the cost will be negligable. In fact, if you go with friends with the purpose to make this armor for them, you will be able to cover all Vendor costs with the Diamonds and blue diamonds you loot while getting the needed components.

Yes, the armor is a pain with the quantity of supplies you need, but you can get good xp, have a lot of fun, and obtain other sellable loot including 61+ spells while you do this.

I think the risk / Reward is pretty good. The AC is not as high as the culturals, but the armors have a lot more too them, more balanced stats, resists, and unique colors. Also, if you are a Dark Elf Smith, use of PoP armors allows you to smith for ALL races, not just those that can use your cultural.

I get frustrated with the components as well, but given that I get the xp and cash loot, I don't worry about it too much.

wyrmbane

[kiztent]

The people in the Quellious bazaar are out of their frickin minds: 1500pp+ for a Midnight Stone? Not from this Necromancer! <img src="http://www.boomspeed.com/sinuuyanea/dcrazz.gif" alt="Pirates, all of ya!">

I can get them by word of mouth for 500pp apice...usually can score 10-20 in a day.

I've had 3 - increasing my stock to 10 now - for 200pp each for close to three weeks and no one will touch them.

[Rendael Brigh]

As I don't do much in PoN, I dont make much of this.

Blood is the hardest part to get it seems.

I have to depend on the bazaar, auction, and merchant farming.

I have seen someone WTB the chain boots.

[Gerwood2]

it's gray Windeliane..