Tradeskill Burnout

[pennyrose]

The recent post about GMing all tradeskills has sort of veered into this topic, but I thought I would start it as a separate heading. I actually had in mind today posting about this topic even before I read the other discussion.

After doing some fairly intensive tradeskilling for a little less than a year, with the skills spread out among various alts, my "crew" has these skills: Baking 243 and trophy; Pottery 233; Brewing 211; JC 200; Tailoring 199; Tinkering 196; Smithing 191; Fletching 174.

A few weeks ago I was elated to have succeeded on my Grandmasters Spoon on the first try, but since then I find myself simply NOT wanting to work on tradeskills. I am not sure if this is sort of a post-trophy letdown or a reaction to 40 Misty sickle combines and 60 celestial robe combines with no successes or skillups which I did recently or a serious, I'm done with this now, reaction.

I have had little mini-breaks from tradeskilling before, when I remember there are other things to do in game and I don't tradeskill for a few days, but this is by far the longest period.

I know those of you here are still actively tradeskilling, but wonder if you know others who simply hit a point where the road ended. I'd be interested in hearing your experiences with protracted breaks and what, if anything, you did to revitalize your interest.

One thing I have done is start some characters on Stromm and these little guys are having a ball. I finally set up a trader there a few days ago to sell some studded armor and silver jewelry I am making.

(Anyone think they have made the whole top end of EQ, including tradeskills, just too bloody hard? Isn't this supposed to be fun?)

Pennyrose

[HoshiAdam]

Between writing my master's thesis, one of my friends moving away, warcraft 3, and a few other things, I took a long break from EQ. After coming back, I found I was easily frustrated by tradeskills. I took all the little odds and ends I had saved up in the bank, did as many combines as I could for smithing, and sold off a bunch of stuff I wasn't going to use for a while. Bought a new sword (Jeldorin) with the money.

I really don't want to start the XP grind again, and shadowscream farming is going very slowly. To get back into tradeskills, I decided to help my wife's druid to level to 51, so she can really help me hunt substances in Hollowshade (yay Upheaval!).

So I am on a tradeskill break for right now, because my chosen skill will be so much easier once she can help me farm. Then the plan is to do smithing till I hit 250.

[Laliana Silverfangs]

A couple of months ago or so, I was walking down the same path you are. I got my GM bakers' spoon, and all of a sudden I really wasn't interested in doing tradeskills anymore. So I put it down for a while. I am in a raiding guild, so I was raiding with my guild, and leveling my character up. Eventually, I got bored of the same old grind, and raiding can be very stressful. That's when I started to pick up tradeskills again.

[Taushar]

I feel the similar way with you. Some of that has to do with insane hours I am working on my new job so my EQ time has been drastically cut (working 10-12 hour days). I am 98 points from 1750 club and I am getting a bit burned out. I hate farming and have to compete with others for greenies. I hate being killed by mob of greenies twice in one night. Getting sick of farming for 3-4 hours so that I can try for one lousy point in skills.

Last night was typical frustration part. I zone in to Twilight with my druid in tow (I am 65 cleric) to farm some swirling shadows. I never had problems soloing or duoing in that camp with my druid. I do camp check twice, once in /ooc and once in /shout. Give about 3 mins and /shout I am taking the shadow camp. No reponse. So I fully buff up and float over the the island. I don't see any one initially. I started to attack the next spawn and I get a tell to get lost. I told him that I did a camp check. His reponse is that he turned off ooc and shout to avoid newbie tells. Hmm, there were only 6 people in the zone and all were above level 50. He says he will be done in 20 mins.

Great, I spent all that time buffing and now I have to wait. I go away and come back in an hour, no one in the zone. This is great, so I thought. I started to kill a few of them. All of sudden a named I have never seen before pops (forgot the name). I started to engage and he starts to hit pretty hard for a shadow. All of sudden I have 5 of them on me. Usually, I can handle 3 of them without any trouble, including named but this guy somehow attracts all mobs around him in a very wide range. I tried to heal myself while fighting and worked about 3-4 times then it gets interrupted and I die. Well, thought it was a fluke, so get myself rezzed and try again. I made sure this time all the mobs were cleared around me and pull the same named. He brought in mobs from the whole island it seems and I died again. Then I logged.

All that for one stack of shadows. That is at best 10 combines and if I am lucky, I will get 1 point of skill up. It can get very frustrating and I wonder if I should continue.

Taushar

[Twinsen Reiselied]

My two goals were: get my baking spoon, and get my 8th shawl.

I got my spoon, and was fortunate enough to get an upgrade to my shoulder slot I liked better than the shawl. So I combined what I had left in the bank, gave some ingredients to guildmates, and decided to finally finish up some quests and finish off levelling.

So I finished up my draconic instruments, and I'm taking it easy on tradeskills for a while until I find another quest that needs them.

It'll be nice to finish out the last few points of baking to have a nice even 250 but being a bard is hard enough on my hands =) so I save what I can and do combines in small bunches.

[Hibashira]

I know how you feel. I felt the same way after I got my spoon. But you know, after a few weeks of xp grinding and a few AAs later. I was back into it. This time was for the shawl. Got some good friends to help me get the bits for 5th, 6th, and 7th shawl, spent 2 days bringing up JC and fletching from 0 to 200. Now that my 7th is done (and getting so sick of clicking combine), I think I'll go back to AA. I'm sure I'll be back to do my smithing some time in the future for the 8th shawl.

Its like having a child. You have to wait till they are a little older so you forget all the bad times before you are ready to have another. :mrgreen:

[Mridule]

my two cents

A long time ago I started to burn out but then I found a niche in the market were I could actually make back some of the money I was sinking into all my tradeskills (fletching right after PoP came out). That was a shot in the arm as far as keeping my tradeskill effort up and going.

I also found that tradeskilling is the perfect activity for when you only have a few hours to play. I reserve my big nights where I have 4+ hours to play for exping or guild activitities and then fill in my 1 or 2 hours play sessions with tradeskill task (looking for components in the bazaar, putting together subcombines, shuffling around supplies to alt, making special order items etc.) To do this you need to buy most of your components though which is not an option for everybody. Plus a second account is almost a nessecity for mult GM tradeskillers.

Recently another thing that helped me avoid burning out was joining up with a good guild (good in the sense of great, easy-going people, not in the ultimate uber sense). I am in a relaxed casual guild with members mainly in the 55-61 range that raids ocasionally (Riders of Kunark on Stormhammer). As one of the guilds biggest tradeskill hermits I find it fun showing up for a raid with a bunch of tradskill goodies to pass out. All the parts the guild feeds me go to cover the cost of the items I pass out. Pluse since everybody isn't already elemental uber, the items are good upgrades for many of them and they are happy to do a little farming on my behalf to get me parts. Everybody wins.


Just my two cp.

[Chenier]

I started tradeskilling because my boyfriend said "hey, why don't you make me some back packs?"

As a wood elf druid, I knew I wanted to work on tailoring. For a long while, I didn't feel the need to take it up to 250 (some folks here may remember my impassioned statement about not requiring ourselves to reach 250). But that soon passed and I felt I needed to get tailoring to 250 with the other skills to 200.

I was close to getting all the skills to 200 when PoP came out, with it's "to-1750-or-not" dilemma.

But I stuck to my goal (after a guild recruitment didn't work out), got my tailoring trophy, finished tailoring at 250, logged out and never logged in again.

[Meirril]

(Anyone think they have made the whole top end of EQ, including tradeskills, just too bloody hard? Isn't this supposed to be fun?)

Actualy, I think the "fun" level stops somewhere around 180.
Getting to be a GM in any trade skill is suppose to be a challange, and to make it a challenge you have to make getting there difficult. Take for instance VT. Getting to VT is insaine, so is hunting there. After a while though, you master it and it pays off. Trade Skills are the same way. It takes dedication and determination and just a bit of luck and you make it there and it pays off. Honestly, I think it pays off in relation to how hard it is to get there in the first place. i.e. brewing/baking are easier to GM than Tailoring/Smithing. Tailoring/Smithing definatly pay off bigger in the long run too.
Unlike VT or any boss encounter in the game, trade skills are individual affairs. Thus, the rewards are paired down alot to reflect this.

Ok, on to the subject at hand. I've been trying to become a GM tailor for about 2 years now, slightly after I started my Druid (which is my first character). However, becomming a GM tailor takes a back seat to many other things, like friends for instance. Also, leveling has a certain ammount of importance (about equal atm, sometimes less, sometimes more.). Its all a matter of priorities and what you can do at the time. As a level 60 druid there are alot more options to becomming a GM tailor open to me than there was at level 35 (which, btw, can become a GM tailor by farming themselves, but its alot more work.).
I've been frustrated at tailoring in the past, and I'm a little frustrated right now but I do other things and it passes. Heck, I even got frustrated at being a druid and started a warrior just to pass the time till that passed (then got frustrated at being stunned so much so started a level 1 warrior after getting to 44 with the first!). All in all, take a break, smell the flowers, do some raiding (that always livens me up) or some grinding (then trade skills are an escape from grinding!).

p.s. as a side note, I started a cleric on Stromm, gonna see how long it takes him to become a GM smith (in hours played) starting with nothing, getting nothing from other players (no gifts). It should be interesting. Especialy since the economy there is...well...realy funky.

[Sanna]

someone in Roomie's guild once said that 'No one actually plays this game for fun anymore after about lvl 35. You play because you need to, because you have to, because you very well might be in a guild where people are counting on you to be there and nuke that mob.'

I blame a lot of my callousness on Sullon, but I can tell the game has changed flavor for me just in the December-to-May that I've played it. What, a half a year, and I'm hook line and sinker addicted, frequently frustrated (I didn't play the Sunday before LoY was patched in on that Monday, because I knew i'd look at my bank and my bags and just cry), occasionally exasperated (a very good friend of mine rerolled to another Deity Team about the time I was level 32, and by the time I was 36 he was already 50+; to top it off, he and his group came and PKed my entire group) but I can't walk away.

I see what you mean. Even the Clico experiment is changing flavors. I guess I thought I'd be making a difference with her by now, not annoying poor Krazic and bogging myself down with the logs and records.

Everything changes, but we still reminice about the good old days when things were the way we liked them. If you're bogged in the tradeskills, take a break. Kill some mobs, get some xp, drink an ale (in game), chat it up with those people on your /friend list that you haven't talked to in a while. Then go back.

Just never get to where you can't smile.
I know, if you need a break from tradeskilling, go read my comic, heh. Not related to EQ, just a shameless self plug.
But mostly, that thing about never not smiling.
Sadly enough, I originally typed that as 'never not smithing'. Maybe /I/ need the break. ^_^

[Cendorly]

I encountered a minor form of tradeskill burnout right after I GM'd tailoring (my 6th skill to get 250 in) about a month or so ago. Then it was only 50 points in fletching and 3 aa's that were keeping me from 1750. I couldn't do it. I would avoid logging on and instead log onto alts. I would log on just to vendor dive or do combines for friends/reselling. Today, nearly a month later, I am at 208 fletching, 3 aa points done, and just recovering from MAJOR tradeskill burnout, something I NEVER thought I would say.

I LOVE tradeskills still, don't get me wrong. I jump at the chance to make tailored or smithed armor for a twink or friend, or sale in the bazaar. I get excited when I find a pottery component on vendors and can make a pop ceramic item with it, or the same with brewing. However, the sheer thought of doing even MORE combines, more challenging of the RNG and MORE breath holding for a skillup has really put me over the edge for quite some time there. I know Fletching is not as hard as smithing/tailoring to GM, and getting 3 aa points, heck some people scoff at that. For me, it was monumental and I was sick and tired of tradeskills! (Something I NEVER thought I would say).

So, I took a break, played alts, started a necro alt, learned kiting with my bard, twinked out a pally alt, and played them all. I had fun again, I would actually look forward to logging on, it was going well until....


The RNG was calling my name. It was taunting me, tormenting me....the thought of Fletching sitting there at a skill of 200 was beginning to shame me. All I could think about was I GM'd Smithing AND Tailoring, yet I was going to succumb to Fletching? That was it for me. The sheer thought that I was ONE skill away (and not the hardest one either) from 1750, my all-time goal of EQ (it was 200 in all tradeskills before PoP) was enough to break me free from my burnout and drive me forward.

Now mind you, all this happened within the past week. I took a month-long break from tradeskills, it really burned me out that much. So...I dragged a friend along, we grinded a few days non-stop in PoP zones, I got my 3 aa's, he got a few levels, we explored the "New" Acrylica farming for fletching components, and lo and behold, I have started the path to 250 fletching.

The best thing to do for burnout is take a break and do something else EQ related (IF EQ is still fun for you). That's the good thing about EQ, there is always SO much to do!! You can grind, play alts, vendor dive, camp for loots, camp for twink gear, raid, explore zones you've never explored before, start a character on another server, etc.

At the very least, even if your tradeskill path ends here, don't fret. Getting to 250 in ANY skill is a great accomplishment, and in my opinion, it's not the destination, it's the journey.

Cend

[Lilosh]

A couple of months ago or so, I was walking down the same path you are. I got my GM bakers' spoon, and all of a sudden I really wasn't interested in doing tradeskills anymore. So I put it down for a while. I am in a raiding guild, so I was raiding with my guild, and leveling my character up. Eventually, I got bored of the same old grind, and raiding can be very stressful. That's when I started to pick up tradeskills again.

Please stop typing up my thoughts and signing them with your name.

It's kind of annoying. :-)

:P :P

I got my spoon on Christmas Eve or so, and I bake in spurts every few months.
I pushed tailoring to 180-190 around february, and then kinda stopped.

I've been levelling lately, learning to raid, and recently hit 54.

Maybe I'll be a hardcore skiller again one day, and hopefully one day soon. But not today. I have had 220 Silk Swatches in my bank for months, and 3 Gem Studded Chains, and I have to clear out my bags every now and then, because I will collect Hero Parts, Tormentor Parts, 3 stacks of justice fruit, and IT JUST SITS THERE.


*sigh*

Life Changes,
-Lilosh

[Reflan]

To me it's not the journey at all. What's so great about endlessly making the same clicks? Or camping greenies that are no challenge by the thousands just so you can make those same repetitive clicks. Then starting the process up all over again.

It's the destination. Being able to have a skill and do something with it.

The journey? You gotta be kidding me. Getting a high skill in a trade is like getting out of a prison of tedium(and sometimes a costly one). Getting done with it is the main thing. Every day you get closer to freedom is a kind of miracle, but it gets so numbing you hardly notice. And it's no joy in and of itself, just a signal that your sentence is slowly, very slowly getting behind you. Warm memories of the days or weeks or months before Governor RNG grants you your freedom? I don't think so. Just get me outta there.

Then I can enjoy my freedom again. And a nice capability to boot.

If I could have bought some skills for 5 copper or 500k plat right off a grocer's shelves and never had any tradeskill memories at all, I'd have loved to. Clicking away on thousands upon thousands of combines and camping greenies for months on end is about as challenging and as interesting and full of variety as staring at a wall.

[Cendorly]

For some, tradeskills are all about the "end result" - reaching the goal of 250, or 200, or another level. For others, for me, they're about the journey. Let me explain..

Doing tradeskills is a compliation of many different sub-tasks leading up to the main task - combining. Some of these subtasks may seem tedious, un-fun, boring, and plain hellish to most, not to me. I enjoy farming. I enjoy farming a LOT (even if I am burned out on it at the moment). There's something to be said about going to a zone, or area, and mass slaughtering greenies (or lt blues) and collecting their treasures. While farming, I get to talk to my friends more, I get to participate and join in the chat going on in the various chat channels I'm in, I'm busier then if I was just grinding. Farming is interesting in that I get excited with every mob I kill to add "another" treasure to my treasure chest - whether it be swirling shadows and wailing/shrieking substances or acrylica.

I enjoy doing combines. The anticipation of "will I get a skillup" each time I do click-click-click-combine is fun. It's exciting to me, it's like a little game I play with myself and the RNG. It's a guessing game - yes/no, and I play it each time I sit down to do a run of combines. I break up the montony of doing combines again, by chatting with friends, reading chat channel chat, reading other channel's chats (ooc, auction, etc). Farming and combining is something more then "just the game" part for me. For me, it's therapeutic...it gives me quiet time in my head, time when I can "play" the game, and relax and unwind, but also time when I think about things, sort things out, kind of meditate. Mostly because farming/combining doesn't take much thought, so it's a great time for me to allow my mind to wander.

Six months ago, I was teetering on the brink of quitting EQ entirely. I was burned out at the high end game, raiding, guilds, the works. I had no interest in PoP, grinding another 5 levels, more raiding, and the like. I loved EQ, just not what the game had become for me. So, I left my guild, retired from the raiding scene, and decided to embark on the trip to reach 1750 in tradeskills. During that time, I not only found my love for EQ again, I have had about as much fun in those 6 months, as I have had in the year and a half I was playing prior to that time. I met new friends, rekindled old friendships and even grew closer to some of friends then I was before. I learned more about myself, more about the game, more about people, more about life in general.

I look forward to each new "tradeskill" session with anticiaption, and excitement, and look back on previous ones to see what went right, or wrong. I remember and reflect on each tradeskill session and have either good memories (like the time I did 17 combines in tailoring on 60 combines) or bad memories (like the time I hit my 100th attempt in smithing with no skillups). I look back on those times now and laugh about them, cry about them, share them with my friends, empthasize with others if they have the same problems I had, celebrate with others when they have the same success rates I had.

So for me, Tradeskills are all about the journey. The experiences as I go along, not the click click click combine part, not the /sigh I have to farm more stuff from more greenies. It's about what I do while mindlessly clicking, and farming. Maybe that's why I was so reluctant to begin fletching - knowing it would soon mean the end of my trip to 1750.

I'm not saying that everyone has to have the same approach to tradeskills that I have, for some, all they want to do is hit the end - and that's fine! Different strokes for different folks. For some, they see grinding and getting aa's and levels the way I see tradeskills. It's just another aspect and another outlook on something - part of what makes the world go 'round.

Cend

[Mridule]

Reflan said:

To me it's not the journey at all. What's so great about endlessly making the same clicks? Or camping greenies that are no challenge by the thousands just so you can make those same repetitive clicks. Then starting the process up all over again.

I would agree that lots of clicking is sort of dull but I don't think the journey taken as a whole is completely dull.

While GM tailoring I got to make items for friends and make some money back along the way. You don't have to wait until 250 skill (or 241 base skill) to start trying for those really good items. I started combining some of my saved up PoP and cultural stuff in the 230s while bringing up tailoring. The success rate at those levels is good enough to make items somewhat consistently, especially the tier 1 stuff since it seems the trivial not as high as the cultural stuff.

Tinkering was even better in this sense because many of the popular items trivial before 250 skill.

So far for smithing Acrylia plate and chain seem popular to twink with but you have to sell the armor at the break even point or even a loss to get people to buy it.

But I know smithing post 200 will be really rough as a wood elf but at least I can make Sickles, Tae, and tier 1 stuff for guildies along the way.

And I will agree that some of the other skills you just click until you get it over (Jewelcraft, Brewing) but those only take a few night to complete.