Fan Faire Write-up, Part 3: Crafting Masteries and Misc.

[wilcas]

I was and will always be against adding Trade Skill abilities like JCM to only certain classes. It gives a small population free run of the market.

Aye - like the advantage Rangers and Druids already have with forageing. This affects the rest of us for alchemy, brewing, baking, and especially tailoring that I know of.

I don't have a 'chanter, but if I had a vote, I would solve the forageing issue long before I spent much effort on nerfing enchanters.

For alchemy, invis potions and most or all the LDoN potions are out of reach for shamans because they do not forage (or forage well if iksar). In brewing most or all the tea recipies, surefall rangers trail drink, and many other things are a pain to make. Unless you go to the bazaar where rangers and druids have free run of the market.

[Proctus]

I think going the other way would be a much better alternative. Since enchanting is the class name and the "class defining characterisic" I'd recommend they make KEI self only, adjust mana regen rates to reflect this change, let bards keep mez and charm and remove the lines from enchanters.

That way enchanters could maintain their lock on enchanting, and they'd still have spell lines for damage (pets too!) as well as stuns, and haste and slows.

Much more balanced.

No offense, but you make absolutely no sense. Then again, you are an sk=p

[Noni DeeCups]

Aye - like the advantage Rangers and Druids already have with forageing. This affects the rest of us for alchemy, brewing, baking, and especially tailoring that I know of.

I don't have a 'chanter, but if I had a vote, I would solve the forageing issue long before I spent much effort on nerfing enchanters.

For alchemy, invis potions and most or all the LDoN potions are out of reach for shamans because they do not forage (or forage well if iksar). In brewing most or all the tea recipies, surefall rangers trail drink, and many other things are a pain to make. Unless you go to the bazaar where rangers and druids have free run of the market.

Foraging: Rangers get the skill at level 3, Druids at level 5 and Bards at level 12. Also, Wood Elves and Iksar have the inherant ability to forgage regardless of class. You could make a Wood elf ranger and a few hours forage anything you need - IF you wanted to. That is hardly as limited as only Enchanters getting JCM - a skill that every race and class can get to 250.

[Koru]

I don't remember, do the foraged items other than tempers drop from mobs as well?

[kiztent]

No offense, but you make absolutely no sense. Then again, you are an sk=p

I'll try again using smaller words.

Enchanters are disgustingly overpowered. Nerf them until they scream.

Better?

[KyrosKrane]

Umm, Kiz and Proctus ... I'd really rather not see this thread tossed into PS or worse, locked. I'd also like to keep it focused on the Fan Faire issues, rather than whether a class is overpowered or not. Could you guys please take it to PM or start a new thread or something?

[Ngreth Thergn]

"BRaaaappp" wrong answer!

ok, no more class bashing... sorry to leave that undefended, but it stops here.

[Maevenniia]

This is not about nerfing enchanters. Enchanters are great just the way they are (except for JCM.)

This is about giving an unfair advantage on a non-restricted tradeskill, to one class. If JC was restricted to Enchanters just as Alchemy is restricted to Shamans or Poison Making is restricted to Rogues, then there wouldn’t be a problem, because no one else would be even able to skill up in JC. But since it is a tradeskill open to all classes/races, JCM should also be open to all.

In my opinion, SOE should open up JCM to all classes (and add tradeskill masteries for the other 6 skills!) or remove it entirely, but either way refund chanters their AA points and give them a decent AA to replace it.

[wilcas]

I'll try again using smaller words.

Enchanters are disgustingly overpowered. Nerf them until they scream.

Better?

I'm not sure why you think enchanters are overpowered - is it because they have a lock on the KEI cash cow? Or because they are not only the best class for jewelry, they have AAs that make them even better? Or because they have the best mezzes and Haste in the game? Or because with charmed pets they make all the other classes in a GoD adventure unnecessary?

They - they - they can't wear decent armor! Yea, that's it!

[Ngreth Thergn]

Stop it. Last Warning.

[Meryddian]

Meryddian, are you saying Enchanters are not already useful in combat and that JCM makes up for this? Yes you have a lot of enchanting/imbueing spells, but they do not take away....

LOL no. I mean duh I know we're versatile. (well, most of the time. GoD makes me wonder sometimes.) Again... a can of worms best left to other boards than these, let's stay away from class bashing. AA's are a seperate issue from the spells themselves.

What I was saying was that we have a *significant* chunk of our spell book dedicated to imbues/enchanting spells: at last look, I have somewhere in the range of ~40+/- spells that do absolutely nothing for me except help tradeskills, should I choose to pursue them (which I did). My point was, if suddenly half a dozen or more pages in our spell book were "nullified" by making the spell ability more "public", what spells would we receive to make up for that? (of course, that's more worms, let's NOT turn this into a discussion about class powers or lack thereof, I'm simply pointing out an issue that would be questioned).

What's the point of doing a combine yourself when you have to pay a chanter to enchant the metal anyways, ... you save all the money you would have spent skilling up.

The only point of imbuing metal, if all you're doing is grinding out the points in the skill, is to get a slightly greater amount of plat back from the vendors (who clearly value an item with stats more than a statless one). If plat is tight for you, this makes a difference - quite minor, but one, nonetheless. Otherwise no, don't bother imbuing the metal first, you can still get skill-ups off non-imbued combines.

Again ... JCM reduces the risk of failure, but doesn't eliminate it altogether. I've got JCM points and lost several PoE combines in a row (and yes, felt really really horrible for my poor guildmate who kept gamely camping the durn things to get himself some new rings). The AA doesn't guarantee a success rate, although yes, I do in general get more successes with it.

The people who have the "lock" on given markets are those who have access to the base materials. It doesn't matter if I have 1750 if I can't get my hands on the items needed to make the combines.

* * *

Mmm speaking of foraging... I've always wondered who's idea it was to require high elf smithing to require lots and lots and lots of morning dew ... when the high elf race and classes are 100% incapable of foraging. (the drop rate of morning dew off Faydwer mobs is too rare to make it worth attempting to farm that way). I'm hoping that'll change to elven wine (to bring it in line with DE/dwarven/ogre smithing) when cultural changes come about, but /shrug not holding my breath.

[Tudani]

The only point of imbuing metal, if all you're doing is grinding out the points in the skill, is to get a slightly greater amount of plat back from the vendors (who clearly value an item with stats more than a statless one). If plat is tight for you, this makes a difference - quite minor, but one, nonetheless. Otherwise no, don't bother imbuing the metal first, you can still get skill-ups off non-imbued combines.

Actually, it's now more expensive to skill JC if you imbue the metals on skillup combines. To clarify what I said, as you obviously misunderstood me: If I want to make myself some enchanted jewelry as a non enchanter, I need to pay an enchanter to do the enchanting, the cost difference between paying an enchanter for enchanted metal and doing the combine myself, and just paying the enchanter for the item in the first place is quite small. Therefore, skilling up as a non enchanter in jewelery did not make sense as the difference in price per item made would only catch up to the cost of skilling up over many many many many combines. Again, I was not talking about getting imbued metal for skilling up, I was talking about getting enchanted metal to produce jewelry with stats on it, the whole point of the skill in the first place.

[Lothay]

Since this is now a enchanter-bashing thread, it is now closed.

Ngreth warned you guys twice. I'm not as nice as he is.