Adventure Points negative impact on tradeskills

[papyscott]

One concern I have with the new system is the idea of adventure points that are earned that can be spent on items/spells.

While there is nothing wrong with this system in general, it does create another currency that likely will negatively impact tradeskillers.

The adventure point 'currency' can only be spent by the person who earned them. Imagine the tradeskilling world we would be in if all platinum was the same way. We might be able to do some trading via barter, but selling items you have made would likely be extremely rare. (much less selling a BUNCH of items to buy the one uber item you always wanted...)

Now, I am not claiming the sky is falling, I am merely pointing out that there is a new currency in the world and unfortunately the way the currency is currently implemented, tradeskillers are left out of the equation.

I won't be too surprised if people want adventure points much more than they want plat in the not too distant future. I think this will have a much bigger impact than people are currently imagining.

Just some musings from a crazy economist :-)

Papy

[Kahmon]

I see Adventure points as being similiar to AA.

You collect and save both, and then spend them as you wish.

[Cantatus]

I think given the choice of spending PP to buy a tradeskill item or spending adventure points to get a simliar item, most people would choose to spend PP. Why? Because eventually you will collect enough adventure points to buy something better and then you can sell off the tradeskill item.

[andyhre]

Add XP to the list of currency as well. I make a decent amount of PP b/c people prefer to XP rather than farm.

One could argue that people will really prefer to XP & AP rather than farm, making the opportunity costs of farming even higher, making the value of someone else doing the work even higher.

So, tradeskill items that are time consuming to assemble, whether its b/c of a rare drop, or it takes a lot of clicking, or whatever, may go up in PP as the value of a coin relative to the bundle of XP & AP goes down.

[Phabos]

I don't know if there is a correlation that can be firmly established or if it is simply a trend based on the recent release that will shake itself out, but I have noticed fewer tradeskilled items on sale the past few days. The number of Traders has been down during the late afternoon and early evening hours, presumably due to adventures, but this morning there were approximately 530 Traders in the Bazaar, and very few were selling baked items, whereas there is usually a cutthroat competition with low prices.

In the short term, at least, as a high-volume seller of picnics, I've seen an increase in both sales and profit. It remains to be seen whether or not this will continue.


Phabos Aphsion
Drunken Paladin of Brell
Tarew Marr

[Furyrpied]

If I am reading this correctly, you are concerned about the value of trade skilled items going down due to the items available for purchase with your adventure points? If so, please consider that the items that you can buy with your Adv points work best when hunting in a LDoN. You will notice that some of the items (at least a few that I can think of) will only cause effects while adventuring in a LDoN zone.

Or I could be wrong... I've only done two "crawls" so far and well...


LDoN 2, Furyrpied 0

*sigh*

[Eumerin]

From what I've seen so far, this won't be an issue yet. The point scales are seriously depressed under 65, imo, and you simply don't earn enough points to be able to realistically afford gear and/or spells for your level until well after you've levelled past the point that you'd consider getting the gear.

Case in point is the level 14 inspect/disarm/unlock container spells. They're 25 points each. That means you need 75 points in order to be able to afford all three of them, and at least 25 of those points have to be in the same theme (since all Brotherhood merchants carry them).

This is no problem at all for a level 65. 2 adventures and he's earned all three. The problem arises for the classes that would realistically be interested in using these spells. Lets take, for instance, my level 24 enchanter. Truthfully, he'd rather buy the level 24 spells, but those cost nearly double, at 48 points each. So instead, he'll focus on the level 14 spells.

The problem is that he's only earning 1 point per adventure (this is calculated based on the adventure he went on last night, which appeared to be populated for a level 25 group, though it might have been lower). He's also earning half a level of experience per adventure. Even providing that experience will probably slow somewhat and points will go up somewhat as he levels, he'll probably be around level 30 before he can afford his FIRST spell. And at that point, he'll nearly be able to cast his high end spells of that same line (in theory, of course, because unless he dies horribly multiple times each time he goes adventuring, he'll never be able to afford one of those spells when he actually reaches the level he can cast them at).

So at the moment, I doubt Brotherhood items are going to have much of an impact on the sub-65 market.

[Arghargh]

Where the conflict comes in is each player has a finite number of item slots to fill. You can spend time to get an item (mob drop, earning PP). You can spend PP buying from players (mob loot, and trade skills). Now you can spend adventure points for loot too. With a new source for items, it should lessen the demand on the other sources.

On the two LDoN adventures I've done, I got a good chunk of XP, PP, and AP each time.

However, LDoN has added augmentation, which complicate things. LDoN created both the supply and demand for augmentations. I can't say with certainty, but it appears that adventure points will be consumed by new demand for augmentations (and spells), and the LDoN specific spells. This in turn leaves the original demand for looted, and purchased items mostly untouched.

The only way AP and adventure merchant items will seriously hurt tradeskillers is if you can buy stuff with APs that is better than anything we can make with tradeskills, or that is comparable in quality while being much cheaper (cheaper in the sense that it takes less time to get the resources needed (PP or AP)).

If tradeskillers are left out, it is that we can't make any augmentation (at least, none that I know of). Given the structural similarity between adding an imbued gem to armor to enhance the items stats and adding an augentation to an existing item, this surprises me.

[sumamael]

People will rather spend cash to buy tradeskill upgrades (that they can resell later) than spend adventure points to buy no-drop upgrades especially because all the LDoN stuff seems to be horribly overpriced pointwise.

[Eumerin]

On the other hand, you can augment tradeskill created equipment. So not only is your BD cultural imbued for +X stat, but now its also augmented by a similar amount for the same or another stat.

Pretty impressive.

IMO, the addition of more cash into the market can only help tradeskillers. When there's more money, people are willing to spend more, which often means prices go up as a result.

And as I mentioned above, unless the AP rewards are boosted considerably, I honestly don't expect them to change the under 65 market all that much. You simply can't collect enough of them in the amount of time it takes to level up to make a difference.

[Carmaris]

Adding augments to cultural armor is currently bugged, but should be fixed in the next patch.

http://pub148.ezboard.com/fpaladinso...ID=18783.topic

[wombat]

LFG downtime is horrible added to the time of the adventure istelf, which doesnt always succeed. This is a huge timesink that generates cash at the same time.

I would rather have a LDON item than similiar Rtrades items because it has 2 aug slots, howvere if it takes me 3 times the effort to get I think LDoN will finish for me after I have the 2 or 3 cheapish items I want which will still require (doing 2 adventures a week on nights when theres no work afterwards) assuming 50% success, 20 weeks per item.

If LFG gets easier then maybe I can do an LDON on a worknight. This will halve the time to 10 weeks an item (400 points average). I will level to the point where I can get my own Ornate plate in the meantime, making the LDON plate moot except for augs.

I am hoping the standard of pickup groups improves as they practice in LDoN to improve success rates, I only succeed so far if at least half the group is people I am familiar with. My Guild is starting a NEVER GROUP WITH THIS PERSON LIST btw

[wombat]

LFG downtime is horrible added to the time of the adventure istelf, which doesnt always succeed. This is a huge timesink that generates cash at the same time.

I would rather have a LDON item than similiar Rtrades items because it has 2 aug slots, howvere if it takes me 3 times the effort to get I think LDoN will finish for me after I have the 2 or 3 cheapish items I want which will still require (doing 2 adventures a week on nights when theres no work afterwards) assuming 50% success, 20 weeks per item.

If LFG gets easier then maybe I can do an LDON on a worknight. This will halve the time to 10 weeks an item (400 points average). I will level to the point where I can get my own Ornate plate in the meantime, making the LDON plate moot except for augs.

I am hoping the standard of pickup groups improves as they practice in LDoN to improve success rates, I only succeed so far if at least half the group is people I am familiar with. My Guild is starting a NEVER GROUP WITH THIS PERSON LIST btw

[OberonMiM]

from what ive seen ldon has SAVED the tradeskill market.

Items that never sold before are starting to sell. Its amazing. Mostly cause of augmentations even the cruddy ones

[Nolrog]

When you augment an item, it becomes no drop. So LDoN is taking stuff off the market. You won't be able to pass that Ry'Gorr battlemail that you augmented with +6 STR to your newly created beastlord. So you'll have to look elsewhere to equip him. So you may look to that tailors Acrylia Breastplate instead (had to throw a tradeskill in there somewhere )