new REQ levels on new Alchemy potions???

[Dracthia Soulblazer]

Ok i have a beef here... as a shaman i was making the new Clarity potions to gain skill. Alot of folks were actually buying them. My beef is this.. they now have REQUIRED levels on them which are NUTS.. My lvl 46 can go to POK and get a KEI cast on her BUT she cannot use the same mana regen potion on her as they now have a REQ lvl of 60 for the Clarity IX which is a 12 tick mana regen.. its NOT even KEI strength !!! The Clarity X potions are 14 a tick mana regen (same as a KEI ) BUT now have a REQ lvl of 65 on them !! What the heck is the reasoning behind this change?. It doesnt make ANY sense to me that a person can have the spell cast on them by a player BUT cannot purchase and use the equivulent in a potion. If i can have the spell cast on me i should be able to use the potion equivulent.. doncha think???

Clarity one when cast buy a player can be cast on any person of any level... and they cannot buy a potion of Clarity 1 level to use themselves?. Doesnt make sense to me.

The Clarity X (10) potions are KEI strength.... KEI can be cast on anyone lvl 46 and above.. why cant that same person buy and use these potions??

Anyone care to explain the reasoning behind this to me?

Signed:
One very irked Shaman.

[Lothay]

Anyone care to explain the reasoning behind this to me?

You might not like it, but it's a game balance issue. It means that potions don't end up replacing enchanters in groups.

Back in '99 when EQ launched Alchemy produced nothing useful at all. When it got over-hauled in 2000, there was a lot of discussion about potions essentially replicating spells cast by Shaman, Clerics and Enchanters. SoE made a pretty clear choice not to have Alchemy be "Shaman/Cleric/Enchanter in a bottle."

Agree or disagree, like it or not, it really comes down to class/player-interdependence. And since EQ remains (or tries to at least) remain a grouping game, then adding required levels is pretty much a sure bet.

[Kheera]

Actually only the text changed: though it stated 'recommended' on the potions before, when I tried to use one on a character below the recommended level it did not work at all (and I think consumed the potion to boot).

To bring home the 'not to replace a live person' issue... would you rather be able to make shaman-level buff potions and thrown 75% slow potions? I'd suspect that would hurt your popularity except as a potionmaker; this is what they're trying to keep from doing to enchanters and clerics. It's certainly better than nothing if you can't get that class to group with or buff you, but The Real Thing™ is still the best, as it should be.

[Bobaten]

The other nice thing about the required levels is it makes the different levels of potions a skill up path for alchemy where you can actually make a profit the whole way. If a level 20 character could use the level 10 potions, they would have no reason to buy the lower ones.

[Phantron]

Recommended levels on the potion were meaningless because recommended levels do not affect spell effects. It's pretty clear they're meant to be required level and someone must've screwed up a tag somewhere.

[Bennan]

The Real Thing™ is still the best, as it should be.

Well the best solution would be to have the potions be less powerful than the real thing, not equal to.

At some point in the game the recommended level will kick in. So if the recommended level for the KEI potion is level 68 does that mean enchanters are suddenly without a group at that level ?


If the reasoning behind tagging recommended levels on potions, is to protect a class from suddenly not being needed anymore... I don't see it as a very good solution at all.

[Aryse Andenter]

The other nice thing about the required levels is it makes the different levels of potions a skill up path for alchemy where you can actually make a profit the whole way. If a level 20 character could use the level 10 potions, they would have no reason to buy the lower ones.

Good point.

In baking, nobody buys the fish rolls when misty thickets are available, and nobody buys the silver fire wedding ring when the platinum fire wedding ring is available (unless there is a large price differential, which there usually isn't).

[Qaladar Bragollach]

Well the best solution would be to have the potions be less powerful than the real thing, not equal to.

KEI and its successors also boost int/wis and mana pool and last for long durations. The potions do not.... thus the potions ARE less powerful than the real thing.

[Bennan]

KEI and its successors also boost int/wis and mana pool and last for long durations. The potions do not.... thus the potions ARE less powerful than the real thing.

Of course that factors into the buying of the overwhelming majority of Clarity potion sales...

The other nice thing about the required levels is it makes the different levels of potions a skill up path for alchemy where you can actually make a profit the whole way. If a level 20 character could use the level 10 potions, they would have no reason to buy the lower ones.

Thats a very good point indeed.

[Dracthia Soulblazer]

level disparitys

Also note that while the Enchanter spell Clarity 1 which is a 9 per tick spell that they get at lvl 29 and they can cast on any level of player.. the equivulent(sp) per tick potion is the Elixir of Clarity VII potion.. whiich has a required lvl of 50 on it. I posted originally to point out the disparitys in the level restrictions.

I did NOT post as a whine regarding selling them, Infact i put very few of the ones i made up for sale. I did over 900 combines which yielded over 4500 potions. Due to lack of space I gave most away to friends but the majority i sold to the vendor. You may ask why id do that, and i would tell you to make one and sell back the 5 and you will see what i mean.

Also of note.. in the database submissions forum the recipes listed there do not match what has been added to the actual recipe pages themselves. For example in submissions and according to Allas database ( LUCY) the Clarity X potions give 14 per tic in mana regen, while here on Eqtraders in the recipe sections themselves it lists the Clarity X potion as only giving 10 mana per tick regen. So the recipes are giving incorrect information.

[Dutchy]

Also note that while the Enchanter spell Clarity 1 which is a 9 per tick spell that they get at lvl 29 and they can cast on any level of player.. the equivulent(sp) per tick potion is the Elixir of Clarity VII potion.. whiich has a required lvl of 50 on it. I posted originally to point out the disparitys in the level restrictions.

Keep in mind Clarity is a spell that gains power as the enchanter levels:
-It's a lvl 26 spell currently, but only gives 4mana/tick at that level, it becomes full strenght at lvl 64 when it will give 9mana/tick.
-lvl 20+ can use the Elixir of Clarity IV, which is 4mana/tick which is the same regen as a clarity cast by a 26-35ish chanter.
-The first level that chanters can actually cast a 9mana/tick buff is at lvl 52 when they get clarityII (and you have to be lvl 41+ for it to hold on you), normal clarity is still below 9mana/tick at this level, believe 7.
-This means a level 50 chanter gets more mana regen from a potion than from his own manaregen-buff..... =(

I know it may seem frustrating that they added required levels to the potions, but the effects are still awesome in my opinion. The potions come very very close to the actual buffs people at that level can give you.