I think I'm a very bad friend

[Lling]

I don't mean to be. I am just having trouble reconciling expectations with reality.

When a friend needs something, I will DO it. I'm better at the big things: offering money or a place to stay if someone is in trouble. Trying to listen and understand when someone needs to talk or vent. Lots of times I am not so good at the little things, like answering a letter or an e-mail quickly, but I do TRY. I TRY to be there for my friends, I TRY to be understanding, and I *always* TRY to do what I say I will do.

So I have expectations of the same behavior.

When someone says "I'll do that" or "I'll help with that", I believe them. I don't usually ASK for help. I try to not be a burden. Asking is very very hard for me. But if someone OFFERS, I believe them. Maybe I am just naive, but that is where my problem is. If they don't do it, I get hurt. And if I actually break down and ASK for help ask and they even hesitate, I have trouble ever asking again. I just do it myself.

I'm a bad friend because I push people away when they fail to do what they offer to do. I view it as empty words - and I am not good at giving chances.

I wish I could learn to reconcile expectations with reality. I'd be a happier person - and a better friend.

[Kcalehc]

You're not a bad friend, you're just a person like the rest of us - and people make mistakes now and then. So long as you keep on trying, you're as good a friend as anyone could need.

[Evrhiel]

I recognize a lot of myself in your description. I have a few suggestions - please take them as just that. If they resonate with you, great. If not, then they don't.

You mentioned wanting to change something around your expectations and that sounds like a good place to start. It's much less frustrating to change how you view something than change other people to fit your expectations.

Perhaps the reason why asking is so hard for you revolves around what you make that request and subsequent response mean. If you 'break down and ask for help' you actually really want a yes answer. But do you ask in such a way that your friends realize how important it is for you? Or is it more along the lines of "Hey, I don't want to bother you, but I could use your help, but if it is a bother, then it's really no big deal, I'll do it myself" ? If they don't understand how important it is for you, then can you really expect them to treat the request with the same urgency as you do?

If they do offer to help and flake out on you, have you approached them with your disappointment afterwards or just push them away and not talk to them about it (or anything else)? It doesn't have to be a huge talk, just a "Hey, I was counting on you to do X. What happened?"

Maybe you're also treating your requests as a test of their friendship? If they say yes and follow through, then they're a real friend. If not, then they must not really like you/ don't really want to help you. How about considering other reasons why they might be hesitating or flaking out on you. Maybe they're flaky by nature (I have a bunch of friends like that). Maybe you asked casually, and they thought that since you sounded so casual, it was no big deal for them to end up doing something else. Maybe they're hesitating to answer your request because they're not really sure if they can follow through and not necessarily because they're weighing whether you're a good enough friend to do a favor for.

Something else to think about - why is it so hard for you to ask for help? Maybe you feel you're not worthy of someone helping you. Maybe you're afraid that your request will be turned down (and hence the people you ask must not really be a friend). Even worse, maybe they'll say yes and not follow through and you have to push them away. Maybe consider what makes you want to help your friends? Doesn't it feel good for your friends to trust you with their needs and problems? Doesn't it feel good to know that your friends think they can turn to you for help? Turn it the other way around - let your friends know you want them around. Let them get a chance to feel good by helping you out. Give them the opportunity to feel how you feel when you help them out.

One last thing before I shut the heck up already. Misunderstandings will happen. Are you willing to give up the people around you for the sake of holding onto your interpretation of things or will it really kill you to talk to your friends and tell them how you feel and give them a chance to tell you their side?

Hope any of this helps. As I mentioned, I saw a lot of myself in you. I moved to the opposite coast from a lot of people I grew up with. Then I realized that aside from my boyfriend (now fiance) all the people I felt close with weren't on the same coast. I realized further that the reason that the people around me didn't feel any closer was because I hadn't let them in. I didn't ask them for them for help because I didn't want to burden them. Because if they said no, I would be utterly depressed that they weren't a real friend. I stopped asking a few for help because they'd flaked on me before. I didn't know them and they didn't know me.

Recently, I talked to a few of them and flat out told them I considered them friends I'd like to keep around. The reaction I mostly got was that of "Wow, I didn't realize that. That's pretty cool!" I even asked some of them to help me move. Some were able to, some could only help a little and promised some other help in the future to make up for what they couldn't be there for. I AM in a happier place because of it. I hope you can get there too.

There, now I'll really stop babbling.

[Lilosh]

I guess that makes me a bad friend too, Ling.

Honesty, and Truthfulness are VERY important to me.

If you (a random person/friend of mine) say you will do something, and you try your best, and fail, that's one thing. That's ok.

But when you promise me that you'll do something, and you forget, or make excuses, or don't even try.... Then that is hard to forgive.

It all boils down to trust. When somebody says something, can I believe them? Can I rely on them?


-Lilosh

[Eowenna Celerdain]

Friendship ...

Well, if it's any help, I'll toss in my 2 cp here too.

Doing your best to be loyal and giving to your friends is a *good* thing.
Believing the best of your friends is a *good* thing.

A couple things you might wish to consider revising slightly in your approach might include:

1. When your friend agrees to help you with something, maybe consider being willing to remind them. Stuff can happen, even though they had every intention of following through ... and not everyone has as good a memory as you or I do. I've been astonished at how easily some folks can just plain forget things. They don't seem to mean to, it just falls out of their heads. :roll: Sometimes they really appreciate a polite reminder, because they didn't want to fail me.

2. Maybe try harder to be willing to give "the benefit of the doubt." You don't actually *know* that they just "flaked out" on you, unless you ask your friend what happened.

I'd imagine that there has been at least one time when you tried to keep a promise to a friend, but "Murphy's Law" interfered and you weren't able. When that happened, did you run to your friend to explain and apologize? Or did you feel embarrassed/guilty and hope they'd forget they were expecting anything from you?

Both are normal responses ... maybe your friends (or some of them) were following option number 2.

I agree entirely that trust is very important in a relationship that you want to maintain. However, I also agree that sometimes expectations can be too ... unyielding. If "flakiness" proves to be a pattern with someone, then by all means don't count on that person.

But one case of failing to meet expectations *might* be a case of "everything that can go wrong, will" preventing someone either from fulfilling a promise or from remembering it.

So my suggestion would be to either remind and / or ask what happened, to find out if they just forgot, if circumstances made it impossible, or if they flaked out on you.

Once you have an idea what's going on in their heads, you can make a much better decision on whether to continue extending yourself for that person or not.

[Kritta]

I agree with much that has been posted here. I'm quick to judge when someone lets me down with either lies or breaks promises on a consistant basis. I suppose I try to give 100% and when I get 20% in return I get frustrated.

*hugs* From those times I've spoken with you, Lling, you seem to be a nice enough person.

[Lilosh]

I suppose I try to give 100% and when I get 20% in return I get frustrated.

Thank you, Kritta.

This expresses my feelings PERFECTLY. Excellent word choice.


-Lilosh

[Morani]

I'm not feeling like my normal, overly detailed and wordy self today but I couldn't just pass by a request for help like this and not say SOMETHING (there is no shame in a call for help). There is so much I could say here in an effort to help or at least help you feel better but for now I'm just going to limit it to passing on some nuggets of wisdom that where handed to me (and I'm still working on fully understanding myself).

The worst critic you will ever find is yourself, no-one can beat you up over your flaws as deftly as your own mind and no ones DOES either. The most important thing, for me, I learned from it was that people don't have as negative an opinion of me as I think they do. My worst fear use to be hearing or know what my friends said when I wasn't there.

If you only expect people to give as much as you give, be careful that you don't give more than they can handle.

Judgement is an expectation with an ultimatum.

If other peoples' actions are the pivots that you pin your happiness and security on, then they will always spin out of your grasp.

And lastly; You will never love, trust, believe in, or respect anyone else more than you love, trust, believe in, or respect yourself.

As I said, I'm still struggling to fully understand and realize these myself but then, as another friend says; "Perfection of the self is the only unattainable goal one should ever strive towards."

[Grenoble]

Its quite frustrating to have someone tell you they will do something, and then not follow through. I certainly would have preferred you told me 'no' from the beginning.

And it's quite human to be hurt/angered by this.

I very simply don't ask anyone for anything. I was an only child, the last of my family (my dad) died 8 yrs ago. I've always been the independent sort, now I look at it as I've got no choice: if I don't do it, no one will.

Yes, I have some good friends. And they beat me up for not asking for help. I have carpal tunnel and thoraxic outlet syndrome but I'd rather carry the heavy bag of cat litter til my arm dislocates than ask someone to do it for me :roll:

BUT...don't let this stop YOU from being there for people. What goes around comes around, and if you can live up to your commitments, well, you're doing your part to make the world a better place.

Likewise, don't commit to something either you don't want to or can't do.

Above all, honesty. With others, and yourself.

[fielan]

I have.. issues. Due to past experiences, it's very difficult for me to let other people do things.

I'm very much one of those 'if you want something done right, do it yourself' type people, and it's very difficult for me to ask for help.

I have to agree with Kritta and Lilosh that it's very difficult when I give 100% to the people I care about and don't get as much in return.

That being said.. I do feel somewhat lucky in knowing there's such neat people as Kritta and Lling on my server.

[Morani]

I have to agree with Kritta and Lilosh that it's very difficult when I give 100% to the people I care about and don't get as much in return.

I'm going to address this particular issue because it was one of the most important revelations I've had in my life about how to get along with people. I'm not trying to pick on anyone here. This is something that was and is very much a part of my life.

When a friend gave me the advice above on not giving too much, it was one of those RARE, fleeting moments when the world was suddenly crystal clear. Since the issue was a MAJOR problem in my life at the time, the result was a big deal to me. That's why I feel rather passionate about the importance of understanding it.

Taking a bit of a round-about way to get there...
If you see a kid who's failing classes but you've seen him/her spend hours on their homework every day and try as hard as they can, what do you think about that person? Chances are that you feel sorry for him/her and think it's horrible that no matter how hard they try, it's not good enough. From an outside point of view, there is usually a fix to the problem but finding that fix can be very difficult. (My mother is a teacher specializing in just that.) Without that fix, can you compare that kid with an all "A" student? Can you give each of them the same assignment and expect that the results will be equal? No.

And you can't do that with friends either.

(Lilosh is going to hate me for saying this about him again... ) I can tell by the things you say that you (Fielan), Kritta and Lilosh (and a number of others here) have REALLY BIG hearts. You care deeply about the people who are important to you and you make it a part of your everyday life to show that. It is not uncommon for you to give even when it means you don't get or even have to give up something. And you do it because it is important to you to do so.

Not everyone can or will do that.

Someone else's 100% may only be 50% for you.

To you, asking that someone to give only as much as you do is a fair thing. After all, you're not asking for anything you don't do. To them, you might be asking for TWICE what they CAN give…

The end result: You get hurt because it seems to you that you're are not important enough of a friend for them to give you an equal share. The friend is hurt because no matter how hard they try, it's never enough for you.

I'll repeat it. "If you only expect people to give as much as you do, be careful that don't give more than they can handle." And to think how much pain in my life I could have avoided if I'd heard those words just one year sooner…

[Lilosh]

(Lilosh is going to hate me for saying this about him again... ) I can tell by the things you say that you (Fielan), Kritta and Lilosh (and a number of others here) have REALLY BIG hearts.

Unfounded, baseless LIES.

I demand you take that back right now.


:-)


-Lilosh

[Draggar]

Re: I think I'm a very bad friend

When someone says "I'll do that" or "I'll help with that", I believe them. I don't usually ASK for help. I try to not be a burden. Asking is very very hard for me. But if someone OFFERS, I believe them. Maybe I am just naive, but that is where my problem is. If they don't do it, I get hurt. And if I actually break down and ASK for help ask and they even hesitate, I have trouble ever asking again. I just do it myself.

I'm a bad friend because I push people away when they fail to do what they offer to do. I view it as empty words - and I am not good at giving chances.

Bad friend? Definitely (sp?) not. You're human.

You put your trust in someone to help you complete a task. YOu put your trust in them to complete a part of it, a part that they said they'd do. When they don't come up with what they promised, it is perfectly natural to push them away.

I'm a lot like that, too. Rarely ask for help, but when offered, I accept. (And that goes for in game and out of the game).

You are not a "bad friend". You are human.

[fielan]

Someone else's 100% may only be 50% for you.

Nod, this was very difficult for me to come to grips with. I have, and I'm happier now. I still give the shirt off my back for the people I care about, and it no longer matters as much when they don't return the favor.

That's not to say that it doesn't still hurt when a friend tells me that our planned fun for the evening is cancelled because their guild called a raid, but.. I can accept it, and accept gracefully. And really, to me, that's what matters.

Thank you, for giving in your own way, Morani. Advice is often one of the most difficult gifts to give, since one is never sure of how it will be received.

*HUG*

-Fie

[Lling]

I'll repeat it. "If you only expect people to give as much as you do, be careful that don't give more than they can handle." And to think how much pain in my life I could have avoided if I'd heard those words just one year sooner…

*nod*
Thank you for your insights here.

*smoogles*