What is an acceptable donation?

[Artemisia]

The post "Tradeskillers Declaration Of Independence " made me wonder about what is an acceptable donation or how do you know how much to donate?

I only asked once so far for someone else to do a combine for me and I had no clue how much to donate, I offered 500PP for a bakery 300 skill combine. person refused it, not sure if it was because they friendly or because it was too small a donation.

So what do you all think is a good method of judging how much to donate (if you supply all ingredients)?

[Fonceur]

Typically, 10% of the finished item's worth on a successfull combine is fair... Of course that can be anywhere from 5-25% depending on the item, number of combines and such...

[Verdandi]

It depends on whether most of the value is in the ingredients or the skill. Back when blue diamond cultural armor came out I was charging 1/3 the retail value of an item to do a (successful) combine. The ingredients were pretty easy to gather - time consuming but easy; what was hard was finding a barbarian with the skill to do it. My prices allowed people who took the trouble to look up and gather the stuff to make a significant savings, while those who didn't want to be bothered could pay me a premium and buy it already made.

Nowadays when everyone knows a dozen GMs in any given skill I'm not sure that kind of premium would be warranted when ingredients are easy to get.

[Nolrog]

For guild members (and friends) who provide all the ingredients, combines are free. If I have to spend some time collecting an item, they should offer something to cover my time and efforts (most times, it will be refused anyway, unless you're super insistant that I take it, then it will be accepted with much reluctance and appreciation..)

I typically do not do combines for people I don't know. I work(ed) up my tradeskills because I'm a glutton for punishment, and because I like to help my friends and guildies.

[GrimwoodCT]

I am pretty up-front about fees for somehting I advertise like aug cutting or a specific item I make with regularity. This is the price, I don't haggle, take it or leave it.

That being said I am squeamish about charging much or even anything at all for sub-combines or end-item combine for someone that I know will use the item and has provided all the parts.

In general I follow these guidelines:
1) No charge for combines for friends or guildies or someone I have done alot of work for in the past. I will even pay for the reagents out of my pocket many times (aug cutting reagents, base diety waters, etc). No charge to enchant metals, imbue diamonds, make palladium if you have the materials.
2) Flat rate fee for cutting augs (1k/success on stat stones, 2k/success on "exotic" augs.)
3) Flat rate fee for masters/gm gear and masters/gm augs. I do not buy materials up front and attempt the item. You buy, I click. You're the DJ, I'm the Rapper. The price does vary based on the vagaries of the market gap between finsihed item and materials. I.e.: if the materials cost 40k and a finished item is 80k, I will ask a 25% "gap fee" of 10k on a successful combine.
4) I charge through the nose to people that have casued me problems in the past. (When PoR first came out I jumped on the laminators for the fletched bows and made a bunch of thel aminators that sold well. A member of an allied guild asked me to make some for her since she had materials. I offered her a discounted price on the ones I had already made. She asked me to jsut make hers instead since they would be for guild tradeskillers. 10 minutes later I noticed her selling her laminator in bazaar.)
5) Generally I don't haggle. I know how much an item is worth, how hard the items were to farm, what my chances are of success and I charge accordingly for a combine. If you want to go cheap, you get cheap. I'll un-equip all my INT/CHA gear and unequip my trophy and I'll do the combine for you for half price.
6) In the end, attitude is the great equalizer. Over 7+ years I have learn to listen to how people treat others. If you are someone that constantly argues in PoK or bazaar, has a reputation of training or dishonesty then I will either over-charge you or outright refuse to do the combine for you. If you are the kind of person that rezzes people for free, constantly buffs without donation or provides help/information to others, I'll be there in a second to help you.
7) I have bad RNG runs like everyone else. If something is not trivial I will tell people up front and let them decide whether or not they want me to try it. I am very much a data kinda guy, I track all my augment cuts since OoW down to 2 decimal points. I keep a record of people that have had bad runs with me and I will offer to make stuff for free for them or (if I've really fizzled an expensive item for them) I'll even give them a choice trader item that they can resell for 1-10-25k plats.

I can't tell you what a fair donation is but I try to keep my conscience clear and my bank full. The balance is not hard to maintain but some days it is a constant battle.

Grimwood/Squeaky

[Melinia]

Everyone has thier own idea of a donation. To me it's: any amount given for product or service that the donater feels that the product/service is worth to them. Sometimes the funds on hand will alter what a donater can give for a product or service.

I have recieved many feeble and many very generous donations for services or product i have done/given for people. I understand plat isnt an easy item for people to come by, so I never begrudge a small donation.


There have been times that I refused donations because the product/service was more of my pleasure than a service. There are also times that I have initially refused a donation because I thought they added too many zeroes at the end. It takes alot of pushing by the donater to get me to accept a HUGE donation for a product/service.


It does erk me when people advertise they will give out an item/service for donation in /ooc, then send private tells complaining about a donation given, assuming the donater had significant funds to draw from. Sorry, if you want a certain amount give for your time, you need to specify your cost in /ooc.


One would also be surprised at the willingness of people to exchange goods/services for goods/services in return. I have given out MTP or brownie parts in exchange for buffs many times when funds were low. I've even accepted cookies & booze

[Orelli Virbonus]

If someone is asking for donations in return for their services, they should be willing to accept anything that comes with good intentions. I don't really think there is such a thing as an "unacceptable" donation, short of people deliberately being cheap, just to be a jerk. If you're that concerned with it, negotiate a price to begin with.

I try to be fair, and always offer at least what I would consider an equal value in terms of time and effort were I the one doing the combine. People who take the time to do combines for others are often doing it because they like to be helpful - otherwise they would make ten of the thing and ask ridiculous prices in the bazaar. Give what you can, and make sure not to scimp on the /hugs and let them know how much you appreciate it.

[Fox the Clever]

Whenever anybody offers some form of service (for a donation) that I desire, and I haven't the faintest idea of what to give, I send the ball back into his court by asking "What would you consider to be a fair donation for your effort?". That way, I can usually get a good feel of what people expect for a donation for said service, and I can avoid committing a faux pas by giving too little and end up looking cheap.

If that somehow fails, and I'm absolutely forced to make a blind guess, I imagine what I would consider fair if it was me offering said service, and then donate a little bit more to be on the safe side.

[Buns]

I generally charge 10%-20% of the products final baz value for the combine, providing of course they provide the materials. Free combines to friends, use to do free to guildies but not anymore (did a GM Halfling combine once for a guildie and an hour later same piece was up in Baz at 20% cheaper than my own pieces. And as far as I know I am the only active trader of halfling GM gear).
I prefer to take tradeskill tagged items in exchange for a combine. Just recently I have taken a Discordant Scoriae for a GM piece and also agreed too make some GM pieces in exchange for a big pile of tinkered subcombines.

[tnexus]

When they ask how much I want for a combine, I generally just tell them, "Whatever you feel the item is worth". Generally by saying this they're willing to offer a larger donation simply because they feel they don't want to skimp out on a donation because they don't accurately know the items worth. One time I got 50k donation for doing a GM arm combine after I said that, and this was during DODH era. It's also just a good way to not sound greedy, and have people coming back to you for combines.

[GrimwoodCT]

It's also just a good way to not sound greedy, and have people coming back to you for combines.

Tnexus may have given the best overall way to look at it in that quote. Its not "How much am I going to make on this one combine/item/transaction?" It is "How much will I make over my entire tradeskilling career when dealing with this person?"

You might make a quick 10k by squeezing a little more out of him or you might just take a 1k out of his pocket. But he's so impressed that he comes back over and over again or recommends you to others. That 1k blossoms into 20-40-100k over the career. One little act of kindness become the acorn that sprouts into a mighty oak of trust and mutual benificence.

This works perfectly because tradeskillers have name recognition, they aren't playing the "hide-behind-the-alt" game, they are in it for the long haul. Customers recognize who you are over the months and years as a competent and reputable resource that can be counted on to do your best. I have a few players that are like that, that will specifically wait for me to show up in PoK then ask for me to cut augs or do a cultural combine. I can't count how many times I've gotten "oh so-and-so sent me, he said you were trustworthy".

I guess to sum it up: customers are the geese that lay the golden eggs. Don't cut them open on a whim and ruin your base of income. Nurture them and ensure that they remain happy and producing plats in return for your services. As a result you stay rich, they stay happy and everyone goes home satisfied.

[Angelsyn]

I generally tell people how much I would sell the resulting item for. Then I tell them the average price for the supplies.

In general, 1/4 to 1/2 of the "mark up" is a fair "donation"... and I never charge the "donation" up front. If I fail the combine, there's no charge.

[KyrosKrane]

Usually, I don't charge for fails either. But if I'm making GM augments, I usually do ask for 5K on a fail. The augment patterns are just too hard-to-get to give up for free. For the armor itself, though, it's free on a fail.

[Ilona]

For people I don't know, I've come to say that I charge 3k per sheet/bar on armour combines (GM) and 5k per aug combine (GM). I think I got these numbers from someone else on the board, and they work fine for me.
If someone is coming back to me on a regular basis then I'll accept less. I'll also accept ingredients in donation.
It's always free if I fail the combine.
Combines for friends and guildies are also free.

[Delphae]

generally i dont charge for combines..since i worked the skillup for my own purposes ( my own GM armor) im not gonna make others suffer for it. The only thing i tell them is they have to bring all the pieces required for the combine. Some donate anyways of course, but i never actually require it.