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  • 200 over trivial/no fail broken?

    I have started a thread about a possible bug in Make Poison combines atm:
    http://mboards.eqtraders.com/eq/showthread.php?t=20288

    Pre DoN release combines with a trivial less than 200 below the tradeskillers skill have been no fail. From my experience and the replies to the post it seems this is no longer true for Make Poison. Now I wonder if this affect other tradeskills also? Or maybe only the former "special" skills alchemy, tinkering, research are affected?

    Any input from failed combines would be great. Maybe this could nail down the problem for a better feedback to the developers.

    Mitsune Foxfire, Vazaelle
    Me, a rogue? Oh no, I am just a tourist, walking by.

  • #2
    Making Blessed Dust of Tunare (Triv 103), with 315 modified Pottery skill, I fail probably 1 per 120 or so.

    Level 70 Enchanter
    Rodcet Nife

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    • #3
      to my knowledge, no recipes are no fail, but silk swatchs and some quest combines.

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      • #4
        Do a search on no fail and you will see a reference to a patch where the chances to fail on items WAAAAY below trivial were reduced. At that time, we were told that any combine that was more than 200 below trivial would become No Fail. Devs have posted here that it was supposed to work that way, and if it does not, that it should be reported as a bug.

        Boleslav

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        • #5
          This is one of the first mentioned of the "no-fail at 200+"

          Originally posted by KyrosKrane

          Here are a few more things I managed to remember from the Fan Faire, with the help of some notes I just found. These notes weren't as detailed as some of the other stuff I'd found, but I'm 90% sure I remembered this right.

          Chance to fail on high skill, low trivial combines
          The chance to fail a given combine decreases as your skill increases above your trivial. I believe it was Tanker who mentioned this, and he said that for every 50 points between your skill and the trivial, the chance to fail is reduced by 25%.

          So, if your skill is 0-49 points above the combine trivial, you have the normal chance to fail as predicted from the formula.

          If your skill is 50-99 points above the trivial, your chance to fail is reduced by 25%.

          If your skill is 100-149 points above the trivial, your chance to fail is reduced by 50%.

          If your skill is 150-199 points above the trivial, your chance to fail is reduced by 75%.

          If your skill is 200 or more points above the trivial, your chance to fail is reduced by 100%. The combine becomes no-fail.

          (These numbers could be off by one point; my notes aren't very clear. It could be 51-100, 101-150, etc. to get the reductions.)

          I don't recall asking whether this checks your modified or your raw skill. I will guess that it checks your modified skill, but that's just a guess.
          There have been several posts by people since then saying they've failed a combine that should be "no-fail," usually at the rate of 1 every couple hundred combines.

          The question is.. are you failing 1 in 20 of you combines? Or are you failing 1 in 200-400 of your combines?

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          • #6
            Can't remember what it was, but I recently (since DoN released) failed something that was more than 200 below my skill level. I was shocked, because that's never happened to me since the change to the fail levels mentioned above.


            Cazic-Thule Server
            300 Tinker, 300 Potter, 300 Fletcher, 300 Brewer, 279 Tailor, 225 Blacksmith

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            • #7
              On my long, painful and slow quest to 300 brewing (still not there yet - I'll be feelin' no pain after I get there), I have failed some of the subcombines that now trivial 200 points below my current skill. Specifically, soda water (1 failure in probably 1000 combines), and fermented yarrow (1 failure in probably 60 ish combines). The trivials on those are 58 and 74 respectively, if memory serves. Is it possible that the "no fail" was coded to the assumption that modified skill would never exceed 252, or that raw skill would never exceed 250? If so, it might need to be looked at to ensure it's a sliding scale tied to the tradeskiller's current skill level (whether modified or raw, I don't know).

              Chase
              Half-Elven Ranger of Tunare
              66 seasons wandering the wood in defense of Her creatures
              Chivalrous Valor
              Firiona Vie

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              • #8
                I don't recall asking whether this checks your modified or your raw skill. I will guess that it checks your modified skill, but that's just a guess.
                Actually, I am guessing the opposite. Since this change, I have never failed a combine that trivialed 200 below my raw skill. However, I have (since DoN) failed combines that trivialed 200 below my modified skill, but not my raw skill.

                Soda water (trivial 58) is a recent example. When my raw skill was 250, and modified was 262, I failed 2 out of 200. After my raw skill passed 257, I never failed a combine (did about 1000 more I would think).

                Not sure if this is as intended, or not. Would be great if it checked modified skill (which I think it should).
                Mannwin Woobie - 75 Druid and Master Artisan
                Shammwin Woobiekat - 75 Shaman and Master Alchemist
                Xannwin - 75 Enchanter and Master Tinker
                Stabbwin - 20 Rogue and Master Poisoncrafter
                Last Requiem on Prexus

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                • #9
                  Mod skill isn't considered your real skill level... It's always been like that. With a mod, it doesn't factor that into the equasion for whether or not you will gain a skill point. Mods I consider an added bonus to lower your failure rate, and that's about it. Albeit, the change wouldn't impact trades all that much, I guess I am happy with the way things are at the present time.

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                  • #10
                    Mods do factor into required minimum skill levels for combines though, so they do affect some things other than success. It's just limited and feels like a bit of a guessing game to figure out which things see the mod and which don't - but that can be solved by trial and error, and collecting that sort of data is what places like this are about

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